2021-01-12    Quest250-LR    Build # 11                                                      My Journal     

Last Post        Post of the Build Process                  

   

The primary objective { Quest }, is to come as close as possible to the DJI Mini:
 
1) AUW of 249 grams {including Battery},
2) Fly Time of 30 minutes {DJI actually lists as 31 minutes}
3) Flight distance of 10K total distance { 5K out and back}

Meeting these goals has sort of become an informal challenge.

The difference for me is that my build will have analog video, No Digital, so that will help with the weight.

Considering this is intended to be a long range craft, certain components {in my mind} are simply necessary {Not optional} including, but not necessarily limited to a GPS unit that is powered directly from the battery, a long range receiver with antenna, a high powered VTX with antenna that is mounted high above the frame, a battery with enough energy to actually go the distance, and motors powerful enough to get the job done. Beyond these criteria, I am optional as to the size, props, and other components used. In fact, I will adjust as necessary to meet these objectives.
 
 

____________  PARTS LIST ____________ { will update until done }

Frame (Arms):          FPV Cycle PP4 5inch Arms (only)
Frame (plates):         Custom fabricated
                                  
FC:                           HIFIONRC F7 AIO (26x26 whoop)
                         
Motors:                     PyroDrone HyperLite 1404.5 2722kv
VTX:                      Zeus 450mW            
Camera:                   Foxeer Razer Nano 1200TVL 4:3
Rx Receiver:             FrSky R9MM  {will wire as SBUS}  I have these in the parts bin
Buzzer:                     FullSpeed Lucky Box 
BEC 5V:                   iFlight 5V BEC 
GPS:                        Matek SAM-M8Q    I just happen to have one of these in the parts bin      
  
Props:    

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2021-06-12    UPDATE

The frame design and fabrication has finally been completed after many design changes.
Although I was attempting to incorporate the 18650 holder into the frame, that concept was
just NOT working for me. Now, I don't have a 3D printer so everything has to be fabricated
by hand with non-precision tools. In the end, I ditched the idea of an included 18650 holder 
and went with a much simpler design. Basically fiberglass arms with a very small CF plate
and a clear plastic battery deck. Nothing fancy and pretty rough cuts, but it is done and
weighs about 32.5 grams.  Pictures attached. 
                   

_____________________________________________________________________________________________________________

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<  The CHALLENGE  now has its own thread  <-- Click the Link >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
 
Builds having the same objectives. These ones are  definitely IN the Challenge:

[Build]  3" 250g 10km DJI Digital Build ......................................        V-22
[Build]  LEAP 4” Long range project  ...........................................        Joshua_A
[Build]  Diatone Roma F4 LR  ......................................................        the.ronin

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
_______________________________________________________________________________________________

Similar builds, but not necessarily in the challenge {but if they hit the mark, they will be}

Other 3 inch long range Builds:

[Build]  3" LR build - .....................................................................       kaitylynn

Other 4 inch long range Builds:

[Build]  Catalyst Machine Works Shocker 4 ...........................  skavage

[Build]  Armattan Bobcat 200 ................................................  the.ronin
[Build]  Diatone Roma F4 LR .................................................  the.ronin
[Build]  First LR 4 inch build  .................................................  andreab 

The list below is some of the early 4 inch build projects before the introduction of the Flywoo Explorer and before the 4 inch long range craze took off. The goals were fairly close to the current goals, however, I am not sure that keeping the AUW below 250 grams for long range flights was actually a primary factor. Either way, they are still good builds. These builds are similar to the current quads listed as 4 inch long range. Keep in mind, that the Flywoo Explorer and the other current offerings will NOT go long range while keeping the AUW under 250 grams. Those 4S 18650 packs they use blow that right out of the water.

[Build]  Ghost Recon 173 4" Micro LR ................................  the.ronin
[Build]  Tomoquads Katana 175 .......................................  the.ronin
[Build]  Airblade UAV Transformer Mini ..............................  the.ronin
[Build]  Blue Steel-Tomoquads Katana 2 Long Range build .......  wllmlutz
[Build]  Katana-LR4 (Long Range 4 inch) My 4th Build .............  iFly4rotors 
[Build]  Phantom-4X (Build #7) Long Range  .........................  iFly4rotors
[Build]  Phantom-X (my first build)  ...................................  iFly4rotors

Threads of similar BNF quads that members have posted are listed below:

Flywoo Explorer LR 4" V2 ........................................................................  kaitylynn
Flywoo Explorer - V1.5 or so ...................................................................   kaitylynn

////////////////////////////////// This Post will be the Build Process //////////////////////////////

2021-01-12

At this point, I have collected most of the parts. 
Now to design the remaining frame plates.
 

2021-06-13

The frame is finally finished. Hallelujah! Now, I can proceed with the actual build.

2021-07-09

ADD Pictures of the FC with Wiring & Motors

2021-07-27

ADD Picture of assembled frame base. The thin carbon fiber plate will be used to mount columns for the camera, the GPS, and the antennas. This plate is sandwiched between the arms where they connect to each other. 

Awesome! Can't wait to see what you come up with. Good choice on the frame size. With 4"or 5" props I think you can do this on 2S 18650! May need to go with higher Kv motors though.

///////////////////////////////////////    Testing and Flight Data    //////////////////////////////////////

2021-01-12

(12-Jan-2021, 05:44 PM)V-22 Wrote: Awesome! Can't wait to see what you come up with. Good choice on the frame size. With 4"or 5" props I think you can do this on 2S 18650! May need to go with higher Kv motors though.

Hi V-22,

Yes, I chose the motors as they have an input voltage of 2-4S and a low Kv. I believe that they might just spin the 5 inch props. If they do that will be quite a bit of prop surface and thrust; we will see.

Also, I am using FPV Cycle PowerPick4 5 inch arms, but I will custom fabricate the primary frame plates; not sure what material to use yet; maybe carbon fiber, maybe plexiglass {it is actually lighter than CF}, or maybe a hybrid with a stronger material in the middle. I also want this to be a deadcat, flatcat, fatcat, or what ever you want to call it; front arms out 90 degree to the fuselage and back arms at an angle. This is another reason for custom fabricating the frame plates; I can get what I want.

Also, the 2S 18650 packs will be the target battery. I have some of these already. 

Also, I put a link to your build and will include others that seem to be similar.

So, Here we go...

I would recommend Lexan (polycarbonate) over plexiglass (acrylic).  Plexi is far more brittle.  

Def want to see a quad made out of other than CF.

But it's likely Lexan etc will be too flexy for arms or stressed members.  Maybe the top plate could be lexan

Actually those motors might not be too bad... Looks like they'll be able to swing 5" props on 2S no problem!

Yooo excellent idea, I'll keep a lookout on this build!

2722kv on 2s??? I’m about to go crazy trying to find your secret, how are you doing this?

So Harry, what are you using the BEC for?  

Also, given you can get lighter GPS pucks than the Matek, is it more important to you to have a Matek GPS or save a gram or 2?  And on the issue of weight savings, is lighter also the metric you look for or if you can stay under 250g, will performance/reliability be what you look for?  Will you go for the lightest components to carry a heavier batt?

(12-Jan-2021, 08:09 PM)Krohsis Wrote: I would recommend Lexan (polycarbonate) over plexiglass (acrylic).  Plexi is far more brittle.  

Def want to see a quad made out of other than CF.

But it's likely Lexan etc will be too flexy for arms or stressed members.  Maybe the top plate could be lexan

Hi Krohsis,

Do you have a source (link) for this Lexan stuff ?? Before it is over with, I may actually try different materials; I have a few thoughts and am open to suggestions.

Thanks

(13-Jan-2021, 03:35 PM)iFly4rotors Wrote: Hi Krohsis,

Do you have a source (link) for this Lexan stuff ?? Before it is over with, I may actually try different materials; I have a few thoughts and am open to suggestions.

Thanks

No specific source, but it is a common product.  Generic Lexan is polycarbonate.

I also asked you a few questions above you may have missed.

(13-Jan-2021, 02:23 AM)Joshua_A Wrote: 2722kv on 2s??? I’m about to go crazy trying to find your secret, how are you doing this?

Hi Joshua,

These HyperLite 1404.5  2722kv motors are actually rated for 2-4S and weigh 10.9 grams so it is worth a try. If the 5 inch props prove too big, well I will just use 4 inch. Do keep in mind that the DJI mini as 4.7 inch props and is powered by a 2S battery; so it should be possible.  

On the other hand, I did just notice that there is conflicting information on these motors so we will just have to see.

(13-Jan-2021, 03:35 PM)Krohsis Wrote: So Harry, what are you using the BEC for?  

Also, given you can get lighter GPS pucks than the Matek, is it more important to you to have a Matek GPS or save a gram or 2?  And on the issue of weight savings, is lighter also the metric you look for or if you can stay under 250g, will performance/reliability be what you look for?  Will you go for the lightest components to carry a heavier batt?

Hi Krohsis,

I am actually going to use a Matek SAM-M8Q which is smaller and lighter than the M8Q-5883 that I normally use since I don't use the compass anyway. Although weight is an issue, there are certain things where I believe quality overrules; this is one of them. On the other hand, I might be willing to sacrifice frame durability for weight savings. 

Right now, my battery allowance is about 110 grams which will handle a 2S 18650 3000 mAh battery.  If it works out that I can actually get the dry weight to about 90 grams I could potentially run a 3S 18650 3000 mAh battery. As long as the thing will be able to stay in the air and fly for 30 minutes with an AUW less than 250 grams, then we see if it will go 5k. I am less concerned about doing anything fancy as long as it will fly at about 17-20 mph. 

Also, I believe that a proper formula {assuming eCalc} should be able to predict the results pretty close, however, the real proof is in the actual finished product. 

It will be interesting. Stay tuned...

(13-Jan-2021, 02:23 AM)Joshua_A Wrote: 2722kv on 2s??? I’m about to go crazy trying to find your secret, how are you doing this?

I thought the same, and V-22 is using some SWAG as all the data required by ecalc is not available from the manufacturers.  But using similar data points as V-22 it appears what he says is true.

If I hadn't seen it for myself I would have said that a 1404.5 2722 motor couldn't efficiently swing 5x3 blades. 

Ecalc is pretty accurate when you use motors that all the data is available and are selectable from ecalc's menu.  When you guess on points that aren't available from the manufacturer, you can get bad data.

It appears V-22 is correct in his assessment though.

Love my SAM-M8Q! It is one of the fastest acquiring GPS modules that I have installed on any of my craft. I use it on The Japalura as that is a free style craft and it will never be considered for INAV.

In terms of weight, they both weigh about the same when actually set upon my scale. Both weigh in at 7.4 grams sans wiring, but both have shrink tube casing.