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CHALLENGE : Sub 250 – 30 M – 10K
#1
|=============]  CHALLENGE : Sub 250 - 30 min - 10K  [=================|

Last Post


The goal is to match the performance of the DJI Mini which is a commercially built quadcopter that will fly for more than 30 minutes and has a range of 10K while having an AUW {including battery} that is less than 250 grams.

Initially, V-22  started a build that would be sub 250 gram, have a DJI system, and would match the DJI Mini’s performance of flying for 30 minutes and fly for a total distance of 10K.  

[Build]  3" 250g 10km DJI Digital Build 

Finding these goals interesting, I decided to also build a sub 250 gram AUW quad with analog FPV and meeting same flight performance metrics: 30 minutes Fly Time and 10K Total flight distance. 

[Build]  Quest250-LR 

From here, others became interested.

In order to match the DJI Mini, the quad must be able to fly for 30 minutes and fly at least 5K away from the transmitter and Fly a total distance of 10K while NOT exceeding the 250 gram AUW limit. 


The CHALLENGE :

Sub 250 gram AUWTotal in-flight weight including battery and any payload, while
                                   also meeting each of the following criteria. The sub 250 grams AUW
                                   is an overriding criteria that must ALWAYS be met. The DJI Mini
                                   meets both of the following criteria while being under 250 grams.

Fly for 30 Minutes:     Be airborne for 30 minutes AND be sub 250 grams.

Flight Distance of 10K:  AND be sub 250 grams; Just Like the DJI Mini.

             Part A:          Fitted with Long Range receiver and powerful VTX
                                   flying for a Total Distance of 10K demonstrates that
                                   the quad technically matches the performance metrics
                                   of the DJI Mini.

             Part B:          A flight video out to 5K {away from transmitter} and 
                                  logging a total Flight Distance of 10K demonstrates
                                  that the quad matches the DJI Mini's actual performance.
                               

The FPV video subsystem can be digital or analog, but still needs to be long range.
Also, there needs to be a recording mechanism; either goggles or on-board that shows OSD info.

The flight video needs to show the Fly Time, Total Distance, and it should also show
the distance from transmitter
 
No Limits or constraints for Quad Size or Power Source.

Considering that this is a Long Range build, it would, out of necessity, need to have
a Long Range Rx receiver and a powerful VTX that is capable of reaching 5K.

Although a GPS is not specified, it will pretty much be necessary to provide data 
as proof that the Challenge criteria have been met.


PROOF requirements:

1)  A build thread with pictures showing the components, the progress, and the completed quad.
2)  A picture {with battery} of the quad on a scales showing the All Up Weight, AUW at less than 250 grams.
     AUW must be LESS than 250 grams for ALL flights 
3)  A flight video with the OSD showing the Fly Time.
4)  A flight video with the OSD displaying the Total Flight Distance for Part A.
5)  A flight video with the OSD displaying the Total Flight Distance and 5K out from transmitter for Part B.

The videos should be full length {time compression is ok for the middle of the flight, but still need to see the entire video}.



NOTE:   The Fly Time and the Distance Do NOT have to be in the same flight; 
            just be able to do both while still having a sub 250 gram AUW.
            
              The Fly Time criteria is that the quad be AIRBORNE for 30 minutes.
              A separate flight for Distance is fine, once 10K is reached, that meets Part A.
              Going out 5K from transmitter and reaching 10K meets Part B.

              If ALL criteria can be achieved in a single flight, GREAT,  but not a requirement.



The Challenge is open ended and on going. 
Any build, at Any time, can attempt the Challenge...Now and in the future. 

Although you won't get a badge, view this similar to a badge; 
at any time, anyone, can BUILD a quad for the Challenge.


////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
If you have a build matching the criteria and want to be included, then please send me a PM.
\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\



 
The DJI Mini references.
 
DJI Mini 2 - Specifications - DJI
 
Additional Spec information in Post #13.
 
 
______________________________________
My BUILDS  ||   My INDEX   ||  Parts Guide  <-- Download


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#2
|=====================]  PARTICIPANTS  [========================| 
 
This is a list of builds with goals of matching the specified criteria; organized by size.


If there is anyone that I have missed, please send me a PM and I will add it to the list.


The Sub 250 gram criteria is a given and assumed that all entries meet that criteria. 

ONLY sub 250 gram BUILDS are eligible.

Wink   30 Minutes Airborne - Fly Time
Cool  Distance Part A - 10K Total Flight Distance
Big Grin  Distance Part B - 5K out and Total Flight Distance of 10K



Nano

[Build]  3D Printed NanoLongRange ..............{ 1st to get Smilies }......................... amped_fpv   Cool Big Grin 
[Build]  1S 18650 NanoLongRange ..................................................................................... V-22


2 Inch - 3 Inch

[Build]  3" 250g 10km DJI Digital Build ..........................................................................  V-22
[Build]  3" LR build ........aka: The Leaf ....................................................................... kaitylynn
[Build]  The 200g flying hotdog  ............................................................................. ph2t

Already Built  3" for Sub 250 challenge  ................................................. The Red Baron   Wink Cool Big Grin    2

4 Inch - 5 Inch

[Build]  Quest250-LR ...................................................................................   iFly4rotors
[Build]  LEAP 4” Long range project  ......................................................................    Joshua_A
[Build] Lu250 Pocket - 2021 rebuild ............................................................  derFrickler
[Build]  The Matrix Ranger 250G AUW LR Challenge Machine ..................................   bffigjam
[Build]   Sub250g Custom Ultralight 4" LR Ghost Build ......................................   amped_fpv   Wink Cool Big Grin   1
[Build]   Sub250g 30min+/10km+ Digital/Navigation Challenge ...........................   littleflyer   Wink
[Build]   CHALLENGE : Sub 250 - 30 min - 10K : 4" to 5" Class : BONE DRONE LR .........    roteron
[Build]   CHALLENGE : Sub 250 - 30 min - 10K : 4" to 5" Class : Fricklick Mini (UL) ..... derFrickler  Wink Cool

6 Inch - 7 Inch - 8 Inch
 
[Build]  Sub250g AUW 7" DJI HD > 30min flighttime - Project Endurance .........  Felias
[Build]  LightFlight 2021 Re-Build 7-8" 2SLiIon 250g AUW .......................... derFrickler
[Build]  LR 6/7" for the challange ....................................................................  pbreed
[Build]  Challenge, sub 250gr with 8", 30mn, 10km... ............................ The Red Baron
______________________________________
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#3
|==================]   POTENTIAL BUILDS  [=======================| 

List of similar builds, but not specifically targeting or matching the criteria, however, they have the potential even though not specifically the BUILD objectives. These builds have the potential either as they are or with some  minor adjustment. All they would need supporting proof.
 

[Build]  Catalyst Machine Works Shocker 4 ..........................................................  skavage
[Build]  Diatone Roma F4 LR ...............................................................................  the.ronin
[Build]  First LR 4 inch build  .......................................................................................  andreab 
 
______________________________________
My BUILDS  ||   My INDEX   ||  Parts Guide  <-- Download


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#4
Don't forget amped_fpv's build here: https://intofpv.com/t-3d-printed-nanolongrange

I think we should try for 5km out (10km round trip), as the Mini 2 is capable of that and it provides some additional constraints to the build (long range RC link and VTX). I'm having trouble finding a suitable location to fly such a distance so the intermediate goal of 10km total distance covered is nice too Smile

And for research purposes I just picked up a Mini 2. It's extremely impressive as a stable camera platform, but laughable as a quad. I think even the 18650 nanolongrange builds put it to shame from a power to weight ratio standpoint. Regardless, it's impressive how much tech they managed to squeeze into it. I parked it 300ft over my house in gusty winds and it was dead stable. It even managed to land less than two feet from where it took off!
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#5
LOLLL I first read that as "30 *meters* - 10km" ... I'm like I so got this loll.
roninUAV | Purveyor of fine sub-250g FPV drone frames. «» FPV threads

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#6
(17-Apr-2021, 07:57 PM)the.ronin Wrote: LOLLL I first read that as "30 *meters* - 10km" ... I'm like I so got this loll.

Hi Ronin,

You got me.  Rolleyes  I have now fixed that "confusion"  Confused  From this day forward it will say "min" for minutes  Wink

I know you have a lot of builds that should or might fit the criteria, so...
any BUILD that you want  listed, send me a PM and I will add them.   High Five
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#7
Oh yah, now we have an entire thread devoted to the "challenge", Now we just need a few leader boards... Cool Big Grin
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#8
(19-Apr-2021, 06:27 PM)Joshua_A Wrote: Oh yah, now we have an entire thread devoted to the "challenge", Now we just need a few leader boards... Cool Big Grin

Hi Joshua,

Yeah, originally, I was just listing the participants in my Quest250-LR Build thread, but as this thing grew, I realize that having it in my BUILD thread was just not going to work. In addition to having more members interested, we will start posting the videos of those who have successfully completed the challenge. Yeah, it was looking more like it needed its own thread. Plus, it would be easier for others to find. 

If anyone is interested, please send me a PM and I will add the Build.

I wasn't sure where to put it, so I just picked General Topics.  Post #2 is a list of Participants...I will mark if Challenge is met. 

Yeah, leader board...interesting  Thinking
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#9
I'm very curious to see what people come up with. I'm guessing it's going to be either nano 18650 or beastly 7+ inch. I can't imagine there being a middle ground for something like this. I'm kinda neck deep in other stuff right now but if I were to take a stab at it, I'd go super stupid light 18650 spinning 4 inch biblades on a skeleton of a frame carrying the absolute bare minimum (no GPS).
roninUAV | Purveyor of fine sub-250g FPV drone frames. «» FPV threads

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#10
thats radical flighttime aiming :-) no gps :-)
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#11
(20-Apr-2021, 09:33 AM)hugnosed_bat Wrote: thats radical flighttime aiming :-) no gps :-)    <-- Not a criteria, but pretty much necessary to provide data for proof.

If it was easy, it wouldn't be a Challenge.

The criteria can be met. DJI has done it. Ecalc says it can be done. It will just take some work; hence the CHALLENGE.

GPS...well it wasn't specified, however, without one there is no real way to tell if the distance criteria has been met. 
So...in reality, a GPS will pretty much be needed to provide sufficient information as proof.

Also, the Challenge is "Open Ended", there is No Time limit. Any one can attempt the Challenge at any time. Any build can take as long as it takes. First a build thread is needed to show that you built it. A build meets the challenge by posting a picture of the AUW and a flight video or videos showing that the craft can stay airborne for 30 minutes and can fly a total distance of 10K {circles, laps, loops, out and back, out and ditch...just log 10K distance in the OSD}.

Also, the time and distance do NOT have to be on the same flight. There could be one video for time and another for distance. 

As builds meet the challenge, I will mark them and number them. The winners are any quad meeting the criteria.

The Challenge is not a race against time. It is an effort to accomplish a task. In fact, a new member could join next month, or the next, or when ever and decide to participate just to see if they can build a quad that will meet the Challenge criteria. 

In some respects, this is sort of like a badge {even though you won't get one}. Any one, at any time, now or in the future, is welcome to attempt the Challenge by building a quad that meets the criteria.
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#12
on lipo 30min is very difficult. Sub250g.. almost impossible
Even if you save weight with no camera, no DJI etc..

So this challenge automaticaly requires 2S 18650.

Because 2S, you get 7000KV 1404, overprop with HQ5030, and voila. Guarantee to have untunable bounce back and wobble. Not good for freestyle.... but will easily be sub250g
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#13
Some data on the DJI Mini 2 if anyone is curious:

Battery: 2S HV LiPo
Nominal Voltage: 7.7V, Max Voltage: 8.8V
Rated Capacity: 2250mAh, 17.32 Wh
Weight: 80.4g

Props: 4726 Bi-blade, floppy
Diameter: 4.7"
Pitch: 2.6"
Notes: Very thin and light weight

Motors: 1703(?) Estimated
Kv: ?

Dry weight: 158.65g
AUW: 239.2g
Wheelbase: ~216mm
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#14
I'm keen as, I have a few ideas Big Grin
I'm really IntoFPV
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Don't forget to rate people who have helped you!
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#15
Hi v-22,

Thank you for providing that information. I knew that the props were almost 5 inches, that is why I decided to go with 5 inch props. The battery is a little lighter than comparable ones that we have available, but will just have to deal with that. Very interesting about the motor size. So...the motor size is interesting. I can't find any 17xx motors...so.. maybe try a 1607 or 1608 which should be roughly comparable ??? These seem to be a closer match than the 1804 motors. but you never know. 

Another thing that DJI has going for it is a super light "plastic" frame/housing unit. So...we will need to get the frame as light as possible. For my thoughts, it will be a custom fabricated frame...maybe fiberglass, Lexan, or maybe CF laminated with some type of "foam". Yeah, I know it sounds crazy, but the frame weight is extremely important. For this, we just have to get beyond that "frame that won't break" attitude. Light weight frames do break, but that is what it might take to get comparable to the DJI. Yeah, the flights will need to be really conservative...very easy cruising, no stunts or throttle punches, and try to be easy on the landing {yeah, I generally don't have "easy" landings}.

I have just ordered some fiberglass sheets in various thicknesses which I might use for the frame. I have also considered  1mm CF laminated to a "foam" of sorts. 

Also, keep in mind that the power source has no limitations.  [Image: thinking.png]  So, if the 18650 packs work, Great. On the other hand, we are free to try other power options. For now, my secret.  [Image: dodgy.png]

Now is the time to think outside the box...get light weight... get time and distance...hone those flight skills to extend the battery life...get creative... this is possible, we can do this. 

Onward and upward  [Image: thumbs-up.png]   [Image: high-five.png]
______________________________________
My BUILDS  ||   My INDEX   ||  Parts Guide  <-- Download


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