If you want to hear something cool, a 10 inch with 7 inch pitch props...it sounds like a pony car exhaust from the early 70s....well not exactly but by comparison to the buzzy sound of most quads.  Deep, throaty, and thumpy....definitely not stealthy.

(04-Sep-2020, 03:38 PM)SnowLeopardFPV Wrote: It's basically all down to the motors, props, weight, and how you actually fly it. You are running far less aggressive motors, only bi-blade props, and your flying style isn't punch-outs, power-runs, or acro manoeuvres because you didn't design and build the quad for that purpose. If you were to build a freestyle 5" quad it would be a completely different story

Yeah, I agree. Building something aggressive is likely going to sound aggressive.    

(04-Sep-2020, 03:44 PM)Krohsis Wrote: If you want to hear something cool, a 10 inch with 7 inch pitch props...it sounds like a pony car exhaust from the early 70s....well not exactly but by comparison to the buzzy sound of most quads.  Deep, throaty, and thumpy....definitely not stealthy.

Yeah, I remember those muscle cars 

Sounds pretty cool     But, just like a Funny Car, I would have no place to run/fly it. 

Unfortunately, I don't have a nice, big, "clean" desert to fly in. 
{where I might actually be able to retrieve a downed quad}
Once I get outside of a park area, there are hazards everywhere. The vegetation and brush down here is murderous, you can't fly over National Parks, I don't think flying the interstate is a good idea, and if I lose it over the ocean...well there it goes.   

On the other hand, I think I might have found a 5k stretch that is "out of the way" and has a wide area beside the road (it is an older highway that isn't used much anymore). Only at the ends, will I need to be very cautious; depending on the direction that I am flying. 

This is funny, my wife thinks I should fly from a launch point down to a local establishment (where she would be), then land.    {yeah, a one way trip}    One problem with her idea is that the terrane is not very forgiving; if it goes down, probably wouldn't get it back.      Won't do that one for my 5k run anyway.

(04-Sep-2020, 04:11 PM)iFly4rotors Wrote:  
Once I get outside of a park area, there are hazards everywhere. The vegetation and brush down here is murderous, you can't fly over National Parks 

 

 

I like how your wife thinks!  Going down due to loss of video or loss of control link is unlikely as there are usually warning signs before total loss.  Not to mention, either iNav or even BF Return to Home.  As for the desert, we have these things called mountains, and ravines, and cacti, and high heat, no water, very rough terrain, so it isn't all cookies and milk here either....but yes, the desert is better than some places, like the Pacific Northwest, where I lived for far too long and recently flew there.  If you do down there, it is bye bye to the quad most of the time.  So I feel ya!

What about flying along the beach?  Maybe in a less touristy area so not so many people?  

I know Florida all too well, and my concern would be less with the brush and more the swampy ground and gators, water moccasins, etc.....

As far as National Parks, you CAN fly over them and through them, etc.  You just can't take off or land on them, including crash landing.  The National Parks don't control the airspace.  There is a lot of discussion on this, and a lot of resources.  Bottom line though, you might get handled by the Park Service LE, but any litigation you would ultimately prevail.  And a bonus for taking a bullet for the rest of us for this, when you win in court this issue would be settled.  I would even come visit you in jail while you wait for your case to go to trial.
I've flown into a couple National Parks now, and into several Wilderness areas, and never had a problem, thankfully.  It does get your heart rate up a bit though, especially when you see people getting on their phones.  You know they aren't calling aunt Susie, they are calling The Man in on you. 

Hey Krohsis,

Yeah, my wife is a sweetheart   ...  I do sort of like the bar idea {since you only have to fly one way to 5k}. At present, the deterrent for me is that it would over the A1A highway, or residential (and brushy) area, or the beach and ocean. Where we live the actual beach space {between the water and the brush} is pretty narrow and backs up to residential property. The brush is so thick and wicked that you can't get through it even though is is only about 20 feet wide or so. 

We have scoped out some other areas of the beach along A1A {where we live} that might be promising. It is however, just like the rest of the beach; narrow beach, rough brush, highway, and residential. My problem is that I'm not that good at crashing where I want to...sort of crashes where it wants. Still, once I get more confident in the equipment, it could be workable. 

I have been using AirMap as a sort of guide. One thing that I can say about the National Parks around here is that AirMap has them marked in "Red" as a No Fly zone. Now, if AirMap's markings come from the FAA, doesn't that mean that it is No Fly rather than no takeoff or land    

Oddly, or at least unexpected, my Phantom-X is the best candidate for the 5k run      I was thinking that the Katana-LR4 would be the preferred choice, but it just isn't getting the Fly Times; same for the 5 inch Katana-LR5x.

{2020-09-10}
New 4s 18650 battery holder with batteries installed; 222 grams.  Now, I have 2s, 3s, and 4s 18650 battery holders which I will use for testing. Even though the holders do add weight, I prefer the flexibility of being able to move the 18650 cells from holder to holder and the ability to charge them with a regular 18650 charger. 

The holder arrangement works well since I do not foresee using the 18650 cells on a regular basis since they push the weight over 250 grams for a 3s or 4s pack (even if directly soldered - no holder). I will likely run LiPo batteries and keep the weight below 250 grams most of the time.  The extent that I run 18650 batteries will depend upon the results of my testing. So, as long as I don't solder them together, the batteries can be used in other devices such as my Jumper transmitter and flashlights. 

The 3s 18650 holder is mounted on the Katana-LR4 {loaded and ready to fly}. I plan to test this setup and the 4s pack on the Katana-LR5x, and the Katarms-LR7x       

I may still use  the 2s pack for the "less powerful" builds; specifically craft with motors smaller than 1404.

{2020-09-13}                                                                                                       Last Post       

I have compiled a list of parts and components that I have either used or would consider using in one of my builds.

This information has been put into an Excel spreadsheet and I have included links for the parts.

Additionally, I have included my concepts, build considerations, opinions, and links to similar products.




2022-07-01   <<  Last Update:  Revised Parts Guide

2021-02-02   <<  Last Update:  Low Cost Long Range Package

{2020-09-18}

Yesterday, I took a couple of my builds to the soccer field. When I was preparing for the flights, I realized that I had neglected to put the SD card back into my goggles (yeah, no spare in the truck either). Oh well, not going back home just to get one. So...here we go...

When I took off with the Katana-LR4, there was no one on the field, however, a few minutes into the flight a park worker arrived, stopped right in  front of me, and began working on the field. Go figure     

It was pretty good flight. The Katana-LR4 was fitted with the 3s 18650 pack. 
The flight lasted 17 minutes !!      Had to take picture with my phone to record the flight data. 

Next, I took the Phantom-3A up for a flight. The video was not nearly as good as the Katana-LR4 and seemed to be a little flakey. On the other hand, it was flying really good and seemed faster and more responsive than I remembered. About 3 minutes into the flight, the craft was headed towards the park worker. I didn't want to get too close and I was feeling pretty good so I gave it throttle and turned hard right...RIGHT into a Light Pole  
  CRASH  

Too bad I didn't get video 

I'm planning on getting into FPV drones, but I do not know how. I have owned a Breeze 4k for a year or so and I love it, but there's only so much you can do with it. This is why I am looking to get into FPV drones. The trouble is, I do not know where to start. I'm hoping to get a cheap, entry-level drone to start off with, but I don't know which to choose.

(20-Sep-2020, 08:27 PM)nikkinemo95 Wrote: I'm planning on getting into FPV drones, but I do not know how. I have owned a Breeze 4k for a year or so and I love it, but there's only so much you can do with it. This is why I am looking to get into FPV drones. The trouble is, I do not know where to start. I'm hoping to get a cheap, entry-level drone to start off with, but I don't know which to choose.

Hi nikkinemo95,

I know the feeling. That is exactly how I felt before buying anything. I bought a cheap "tiny whoop" combo kit which included everything including a cheap set of goggles. The kits are much better now and they cost more. One such combo is the BetaFPV Starter Kit 2 for 129 USD. These combos generally come with a small tiny whoop quad. While these quads are fun indoors, that is about the real limit. On the other hand, the EMAX TinyHawk II combo for 190 US dollars comes with decent set of goggles, a pretty good transmitter, and {most importantly} a quad that I would recommend. Yeah, I own one. If I were considering a combo, this would be the one. 

So, you might check them out, but you might also consider just getting the "real deal" gear that you can keep...well...for a very, very, long time. While the combo kits include "everything", the goggles are generally the only thing that you can keep using as you advance. In fact, moving up to anything else will require a different radio remote control transmitter {transmitter} at the very least. 

Now, let's consider a cost effective way to get into the game and have gear that you can advance with as you have a lot of fun. 

First, you will need a set of goggles. If you don't wear eyeglasses, there are a lot of options. You can get a decent set of inexpensive goggles for about 50-70 US dollars. One of the best cost effective goggles are the Eachine EV800D for about 100 dollars. You can even use these goggles for long range. {I just bought a set for my long range flights}. That said, there are many good goggles out there and it really comes down to what you want and how much you are willing to pay. 

Next, you will need a transmitter. When I bought my "real" transmitter, I wanted something that would allow me to fly as many protocols as possible, even my toy quads. These are known as multi-protocol modules/transmitters. When I bought my Jumper T16 with multi-protocol module, it was the only real choice. I still use this transmitter to fly pretty much all of my drones whether they are the Bayang "toy" protocol, my FrSky protocol quads, or anything else that I might buy or build. But, now there are more choices. If I were to buy one today, I would likely get the RadioMaster T16S  or maybe the new RadioKing tx18 Lite  .  Both are basically upgraded clones of the Jumper radio. They both come with an internal multi-protocol module which leaves the JR bay open for a long range module such as the TBS crossfire, the FrSky R9 module, or the new ImmersionRC Ghost module. At this point, I am not sure about the RadioKing (although it is cheaper, in fact at 90 US dollars it is quite a lot for the money).  I am leaning toward the RadioMaster, however, the RadioKing looks like a really good deal...tempting.  So, the cost would be about 90 to 150 US dollars. Before you buy anything, do some research.

Now, we are ready to look for a BNF (already built and ready to fly; just Bind-N-Fly). Although there are a lot of opinions on what you should start with...small, medium, large, average, fast, cheap, expensive, a racer, a freestyle, a cruiser, a cinematic, etc. The smaller quads are just as fun to fly as the larger ones, but they are cheaper and more durable. When you crash {yes, you will crash} there is less chance of damage to the quad or whatever you hit. For me, I wanted a quad that would be sort of easy to fly in the beginning, yet be capable enough to do acro stunts if you want to. Again, there are many options out there. My first two BNF quads were the EMAX TinyHawk Freestyle and the GEPRC Phantom. Both of these quads are 2.5 inch {props} and fly really well. The EMAX TinyHawk Freestyle II is a little cheaper than the GEPRC Phantom, but the Phantom uses more standard parts (more readily replaceable and upgradable). Although I still fly both of these quads, I actually prefer the GEPRC Phantom and still fly it more. In fact, I would likely keep it small to start; smaller quads break less and are less costly when they do. My first choice would be one of these, however, you might want to see what else is out there before making a final decision.

Here is the GEPRC Phantom thread on IntoFPV.  

Yeah, I am a little biased toward the GEPR products and especially the Phantom, but they are good products. I have several builds based on the GEPRC Phantom frame:  Phantom-X, Phantom-i, Phantom-3A, Phantom-4X

So, this is how I would sum it up:

On the cheaper side, you could get goggles for about 60, transmitter for about 90, and quad for about 130 US dollars. Everything for less than 300 US dollars; with very much upgrades you will be around (or over) 400 US dollars total.
If you can afford the "buy in" and think this is where you want to go, then I would strongly consider going this route.

On the other hand, if you have a tighter budget or just want something less costly, I would consider the EMAX TinyHawk II combo kit for less than 200 US dollars. In fact, this would likely be the only "combo" kit that I would buy; mostly because it contains a really good quad.

Since you are outside the US, the product links are for vendors {basically Banggood} that are outside the US, however, there are other vendors especially if you live in the United States.

I hope that this helps you and others to be successful with breaking into the world of FPV and to be happy with your decisions.   

This forum is filled with members who have a lot of knowledge and are very helpful.

{2020-09-24}

Finally got a Fly day...yesterday, I took out the Katana-LR4, Katana-LR5x, and the Phantom-i.  Now that I give the GPS time to get locked in, the additional data is providing new {interesting at the very least} insights.

The Katana-LR4 with a 3s 18650 pack had a Fly Time over 21 minutes and Total Flight Distance of 7.25Km

The Katana-LR5x with a 3s 1100mAh GNB had a Fly Time over 11 minutes and Total Flight Distance of 5.11Km.

>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Also, my EV800D goggles have arrived      Still in the box, but at least now I have them. 

Given the results so far, I think it is time to get the Katarms-LR7x and the Phantom-4X builds completed 

Yesterday {2020-09-25} I took out the Phantom-i, the Katana-LR4, and the Katana-LR5x .
These were mostly battery test flights used for collecting data; Ah, the results are interesting. 

First, the Phantom-i {GEPRC Phantom clone with  2.5 inch props on GEPRC 1103 8000kv motors}; it is interesting that the 3s 650 mAh battery had a lower flight time than the 2s 650 mAh battery. So, in moving to 3s, the 1100 mAh battery had the best performance. Thing is, just moving to 3s shows no advantage, what so ever. On the other hand, moving to higher mAh values does provide longer Fly Times.

Next, the Katana-LR4 was flown with the 4s 3000 mAh 18650 battery pack (in holder). Interestingly,  the 4s 18650 pack had a Fly Time that was, surprisingly, the same as the 3s 18650 pack. We have reached the point of diminishing returns. That said, I am working on a lighter packaging for the 18650 cells to reduce the weight {but still not willing to solder them together}. We will see how this works out.

Finally, the Katana-LR5x  was flown with a 4s 650 mAh battery. Since the weight of this battery is comparable to the 3s 1100 battery, the test was basically to see if you get better results moving up in the mAh area or in the battery cell count for the same weight. The concept is that you are moving up from a 2s 650 mAh battery and want to know if you should increase the mAh or the cell count to generate the longest fly time. The Fly Time with the 4s 650 was considerably (about 2 minutes) less than the 3s 1100 mAh battery. The indication is that better Fly Time can be achieved with higher mAh values over higher cell count. Get the most mAh capacity that you can while staying within your weight category. Where ever you are, if you want longer Fly Time, then increase the mAh capacity over cell count.

It looks like I am right on the cusp of a power (drive train + battery) to weight ratio that is optimal for the current configuration in both the Katana-LR4 and the Phantom-X. 

Now, I need to optimize (reduce) the weight on the 4s 18650 pack. Since I do not want to solder them together, I am working on a different method of combining them in a manner other than the standard "holder". We will see how this works out.  

Stay Tuned...

This morning my wife was showing me a (4K) drone photo of Wisconsin fall colors on rolling hills to the horizon, from a Facebook friend of hers. She asked me “Don’t you want that kind of drone? I explained my love of the Whoop size, and “We don’t have those scenic views here in So. FL”. (And didn’t get into 1S vs her fear of batteries in the house)

YouTube suggested I watch your Katana-LR4 video and I was surprised at how beautiful FL looks where you are. It was also neat to get a feel for what various altitudes looked like from the telemetry feedback. The thriller during the final return had me on the edge of my chair after such a calm strolling flight.

Thanks, cyclicalobsessive.  

Check this one out Katana-LR5x maiden flight.

One of the things that I like about these drones over those "automatic" DJI type (4K) drones is that you have much more control and can do stunts if you want to. You can't do acro flying with those other drones. You get more of the thrill of actually flying and controlling the drone...kind of like the difference between driving a motorcycle vs driving a Tesla (where you can fall asleep). For me, it is the experience of flying...if you don't fly it, the craft will crash.  

Then there is the building and repair. I like building these drones and being able to fix them when they break. You get to build the type of drone that you want, experiment, explore, learn and experience that creative excitement. If something breaks, you can repair it.

Hey Harry, I just saw this journal thread man and wish I would have seen it earlier. Feel like I'm late to the party lol. This is an awesome idea! Tracking your progress as well as helping out people along the way. It's a really good read man! You're getting some crazy flight times on your quads too man. 17 minutes, 21 minutes, holy cow man. Keep it up man I'm enjoying the ride! Congrats on VIP by the way, you deserve it buddy!