Hey guys, 

I'm honestly pretty disappointed with my new TBS Fusion module right now... I'm using it with Skyzone 02C goggles and the module adapter.  

First off, the colours on reds/oranges using look hot pink and some shades of blue get rendered as green.  And the colours often flash.  Is this just normal behaviour for these image combining modules, because the colours look totally normal using my Skyzone built -in RX.  TBS support say's it's because of certain camera manufacturers not adhering to video standards.  

I have the colour issue with Caddx Ant, Caddx Ratel Starlight and Foxeer Razor Nano.  The Runcam Split 3 is the only one that looks correct.  I also got it for increased sensitivity for longrange, but honestly don't see much difference compared to my Skyzone RX (in fairness, I haven't done any side by side testing). I've messed with the camera image settings and the goggle settings extensively and I can get an improvement, but not a fix that looks as good as my Skyzone diversity RX.  The extra sensitivity was one of the main reasons I got it, because I don't fly a lot of bando's at the moment.

Second, PSA... I recommend turning Fusion Mode OFF for long range!  Apparently this is commonly known by some that do long range, but it wasn't obvious to me.  I got my new Fusion Module and took off with my NanoLongRange and just over 1km out the screen scrolled and then went absolutely solid black for 30+ sec.  The only reason I didn't crash was I had BF rescue mode working.  After turning Fusion OFF, I haven't had this issue.  Again TBS support say's it a compatibility issue with the Caddx Ant camera.  BTW, there's actually a recent Botgrinder video where he had the exact same issue with a Caddx Ant and Fusion module going to Black screen and he lost the quad on a mountain.

The menu interface is great.  No complaints there.

It was a tough choice between Fusion and Rapidfire.
I use Ghost RC link, so the Crossfire integration and WiFi is of zero use to me, but it came down to:
1. Recent performance reviews are saying that Fusion is equal to Rapidfire now...
2. I couldn't find Rapidfire in stock anywhere
3. Fusion is $50 cheaper than Rapidfire

But, now I'm wondering if I made the wrong choice.

Just wondering what other's experience are, because all the reviews I've seen on the V2 hardware are pretty positive, so maybe I just got a bad unit or are these typical behavior's?

I get all sorts of freaky colours on rapidfire with most of my cameras. the red brick coloured baseball diamond gravel I launch from is also hot pink. maybe it is a product of the image combining. id stopped noticing it a long time ago.

ive read the same recommendation for traditional diversity over rapidfire or fusion modes but I've used the rapidfire modes often enough without issue at extended ranges. They used to get a screen rolling thing in the early firmware that I believe the recommendation started from. I've never had this happen since the first rapidfire update to fix it.

(01-Jun-2021, 02:54 AM)EVILsteve Wrote: I get all sorts of freaky colours on rapidfire with most of my cameras. the red brick coloured baseball diamond gravel I launch from is also hot pink. maybe it is a product of the image combining. id stopped noticing it a long time ago.

ive read the same recommendation for traditional diversity over rapidfire or fusion modes but I've used the rapidfire modes often enough without issue at extended ranges. They used to get a screen rolling thing in the early firmware that I believe the recommendation started from. I've never had this happen since the first rapidfire update to fix it.

EVILsteve,
Thanks for the feedback. Good to know the colour thing isn't just specific to Fusion.

Maybe my expectations were just too high.
The 30sec blackout and panic 2 days after getting it didn't help either!
Maybe those are things they can improve in future firmwares.

I have both, and neither of them produce the beautiful colors I get in my Sky03O with the built in receivers, but the Rapidfire is substantially better than the Fusion. It's significantly better in general performance too, and simply overall experience.

My Rapidfire is the latest, and I have not noticed a problem with color at all, just not as nice as the 03O, but now I'll be watching for it.

Regarding long range, I find my Rapidfire module delivers a far superior image/feed than anything I've ever seen. I'm blown away by its ability to instantly fuse the two feeds. In comparison, well I don't feel there really is one to be made, but if I tried, RF makes the Fusion look like it isn't doing anything special at all. My Fusion is has the upgraded hardware, and latest firmware. I honestly dont see myself ever using it again, at least not for FPV. It really doesn't compare.

I know it may sound like I've been sippin the kool aid, but I truly took the longest possible path possible to getting rapidfire, for just that reason, the kool aid sippin promotion of it alongside FS goggles. Well, I was right on the money as far as the FS goggles (no thank you, and forgive me if you use them,) but the Rapidfire is legit, and far far beyond anything else I've seen, and I dont care what is shown in youtube side by side videos. My own experience makes those videos seems fishy in retrospect.

I enjoy gains from the RF module at all ranges up to 1.5 miles (so far,) and to the point that it's a different experience. I miss the colors of the stock recievers in the 03O, but with that said, I haven't even played around with the color settings yet in the Orqas that I use with the Rapidfire. I really need to try tuning the image. Anyway, I have my rapidfire paired up with two stubby omni's, oriented perpendicular to each other, the Lumineir axiis, and I think they are somewhat intended to be used on Rapidfire. My understanding is that this is the intended antenna configuration for Rapidfire, two omnis perpendicular to each other.

Anyway, pressing on past the Fusion is one of the more important moves I've made for myself in FPV. Rapidfire is a game changer, truly. PM me, and if you're close, I am more than happy to meet up and let you demo it side by side, but I'm also fully confident in recommending you go straight for it. If you get one on my recommendation, and don't like it, I will buy it from you. I really will.

I have no issues whatsoever with my TBS Fusion module and I love it (BTW and for the record, I am not a TBS fan boy). Maybe you ended up with a dud. I've never tried RapidFIRE so I can't comment on that but there is more than one comparison online showing Fusion and RF to be pretty much on par with each other. As you say, colours aren't the best but that seems to be one of the downsides of all all the modules that do image combining.

My RF module on HD02’s does show some weird color blending issues when set to Rapidfire mode compared to when I fly traditional diversity on RF or via my Hiee 7” monitor.

Definitely something going on with the image blending and sync reconstruction stuff on such modules.

Everyone’s perception of colours is different.

Even the youtube videos based on Gopro recordings inside the goggles is not a proper bench mark. The colours I see on Gopro recordings afterwards is different from what I see with my eyes.

My gripe with RF is that IRC seems to have stopped improving it. The last firmware update was more than an year ago. And no new hardware revisions out lately.

I like the fact that TBS never gave up improving their Fusion module not just via hardware upgrades or firmware upgrades. Besides they planned it better by adding a wifi module on it which makes it future proof for so much functionality.

(02-Jun-2021, 01:18 PM)SnowLeopardFPV Wrote: I have no issues whatsoever with my TBS Fusion module and I love it (BTW and for the record, I am not a TBS fan boy). Maybe you ended up with a dud. I've never tried RapidFIRE so I can't comment on that but there is more than one comparison online showing Fusion and RF to be pretty much on par with each other. As you say, colours aren't the best but that seems to be one of the downsides of all all the modules that do image combining.

Absolutely. I am only 1 data point, and maybe I have a dud, but prior to trying RF, other than color, and all the integration features that are not applicable to me, I was underwhelmed, yes, but I don't recall or taking issue with the general performance. Of course this does not at all mean I dont have a dud, just that it seemed to perform at least on par with the receivers in the 03Os (minus the beautiful colors.) The thought of it possibly being a dud never occurred to me. Thanks for pointing that out.

"...seems to be one of the downsides of all all the modules that do image combining."

So does this suggest I might see better color switching off image combine on the RF, or I suppose any similar module? I guess that was the trick with the 04X's early firmware; to make them usable, switch off combine/set to regular diversity. I will have to play with this, but anytime I have the thing turned on I want to be flying. I need to make some time to play with it, but it's been so sweet right out of the box I haven't even had the urge to play (this is unheard of for me.) The thing really gets out of the way. The only couple times it has caught me up, it stopped displaying the OSD in the goggles, but that could be my goggles too, I think.

Id be very curious to hear your thoughts if you get a chance to try Rapidfire. I feel obligated to urge you to do so, because it's that good.

Buuut.. I guess I really need to get to the bottom of whether my fusion is a dud or not, as that would affect my recommendatio . Would you want to try a little experiment? I can send you my module, with return shipping label, and you could compare it with yours. You would have no liability under any circumstance, so no pressure from the unforseen. And no time schedule whatsoever, purely at your leisure, 100%. Anyway, just a thought.

TBH, unless you are flying somewhere with lots of multi-pathing I think you may be better off just using legacy diversity mode for better colour experience. The image combining feature seems to work best when you use two of the same types of antenna. Mixing an omni with a patch seems to give mixed results, so if you use a mixed antenna setup then legacy mode is probably a better option to use in my opinion.

I'm across the pond in the UK so sending an expensive module back and forth probably isn't the best idea. If I do get the chance to try an RapidFIRE module I will certainly give one a try. One of the main reasons that I avoided buying a RF module and bought a Fusion instead was because of all the reports about rolling screens. You still even see reports of that today with the people who are running the latest RF firmware. I guess it does really depend on what equipment you run (camera and  VTX combination) but I've never heard of anyone complaining about that same problem on a Fusion module. Skyzone also appear to have been plagued by the same issue with their new RapidMix module which I believe is still unfixed.

I don't know how you can verify whether or not your Fusion is a dud. Unfortunately there will always be sub-par components than manage to make it past QC and out into the wild. That is just the nature of electronics in general. The only way to know would be to try and find someone else who already had one so you can do a direct comparison with yours. Alternatively buy another, but that would be an expensive experiment.

I've seen people equally slating both the Fusion and the RapidFIRE modules for various reasons, so I guess neither of them are perfect and you just have to pick your poison

(02-Jun-2021, 11:53 PM)SnowLeopardFPV Wrote: TBH, unless you are flying somewhere with lots of multi-pathing I think you may be better off just using legacy diversity mode for better colour experience. The image combining feature seems to work best when you use two of the same types of antenna. Mixing an omni with a patch seems to give mixed results, so if you use a mixed antenna setup then legacy mode is probably a better option to use in my opinion.

On any receivers I've had, I 've usied matching antenna all but a few times. I have matching omnis on the RF, perpendicular to each other. But yes, you make a good point about when traditional diversity may be optimal. As far as the tradeoff, I can only observe that I already cast my vote and it seems I gave up the color. In my area, the benefit of the image reconstruction is far beyond compelling, almost shocking. I fly at home mostly, which is near the top of a big hill. There is a large antenna array at the top, and there are countless antennas ALL OVER the valley pointed up at it. Thankfully, it seems most of it clears the property/zone that I fly in 90% of the time, and when I fly out, I'm actually descending below take off elevation for up to about 3km. From what I can tell (mostly in the form of reduced range on trips down the draw/canyon, and the intensity of the effect has pretty high variance, day to day,) it still makes for an RF noisy environment, but nothing show stopping. Anyway, the RF module absolutely out performs anything i've tried when I'm out at the edge of the property, momentarily passing behind obstructions to my LOS. Where the 03Os and Fusion show signal breakup and completely lose the image, the RF produces a solid image nearly everytime, only minorly stuttering when it doesn't. First times experiencing it, it felt like I had super powers.

(02-Jun-2021, 11:53 PM)SnowLeopardFPV Wrote: I'm across the pond in the UK so sending an expensive module back and forth probably isn't the best idea. If I do get the chance to try an RapidFIRE module I will certainly give one a try. One of the main reasons that I avoided buying a RF module and bought a Fusion instead was because of all the reports about rolling screens. You still even see reports of that today with the people who are running the latest RF firmware. I guess it does really depend on what equipment you run (camera and  VTX combination) but I've never heard of anyone complaining about that same problem on a Fusion module. Skyzone also appear to have been plagued by the same issue with their new RapidMix module which I believe is still unfixed.

Yep, that answers that question for sure. Hey, do you mind linking to any of those Rapidfire discussions? Not to verify anything, but I'm interested in the general discussion. I guess I should do a search here because I'd bet it's a good one. Assuming the incompatible hardware theory is true, it'd be awesome to have a crowd sourced hardware compatibility table for each module.

(02-Jun-2021, 11:53 PM)SnowLeopardFPV Wrote: I don't know how you can verify whether or not your Fusion is a dud. Unfortunately there will always be sub-par components than manage to make it past QC and out into the wild. That is just the nature of electronics in general. The only way to know would be to try and find someone else who already had one so you can do a direct comparison with yours. Alternatively buy another, but that would be an expensive experiment.

Good point, and indeed obtaining a direct comparison is why I was seeking your help. Also, I'd spend the extra $50 without blinking, and buy another RF module if I was gonna spend on modules. I'm guessing my Fusion module will eventually be passed on to someone that needs a module (any module,) and will appreciate it regardless.

(02-Jun-2021, 11:53 PM)SnowLeopardFPV Wrote: I've seen people equally slating both the Fusion and the RapidFIRE modules for various reasons, so I guess neither of them are perfect and you just have to pick your poison

This seems perfectly reasonable. I guess for me the numbers just added up such that the Rapidfire is vastly better in image stability than at least a couple of the other top modules. Image quality goes to the 03Os though. Ill have to experiment, and see what I can do to coax the best possible image out the orqas and the rapidfire.

Cheers-

(03-Jun-2021, 08:23 PM)Santiago Wrote: Yep, that answers that question for sure. Hey, do you mind linking to any of those Rapidfire discussions? Not to verify anything, but I'm interested in the general discussion. I guess I should do a search here because I'd bet it's a good one. Assuming the incompatible hardware theory is true, it'd be awesome to have a crowd sourced hardware compatibility table for each module.

Most of the discussion has either been on RCG or Facebook. I hate Facebook because everything gets posted in private groups and you can never seem to find anything again a few days after you've read it. The behemoth 176 page RapidFIRE discussion thread on RCG with any related discussion is at the link below. Maybe best to go to the last page and start reading backwards, otherwise you will be there for weeks trying to read all the posts...

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?3042128

(03-Jun-2021, 10:47 PM)SnowLeopardFPV Wrote: Most of the discussion has either been on RCG or Facebook. I hate Facebook because everything gets posted in private groups and you can never seem to find anything again a few days after you've read it. The behemoth 176 page RapidFIRE discussion thread on RCG with any related discussion is at the link below. Maybe best to go to the last page and start reading backwards, otherwise you will be there for weeks trying to read all the posts...

https://www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?3042128

I loathe FB. Joined in 2008. The last time I was on, 2017. It's a despicable crime the way community sourced knowledge is gathered, and sinkholed there. It's a crying shame, and a tragedy, and a tremendous loss.

Thanks for the link. It's exactly what I had in mind.

Does Fusion have two modes like Rapidmix?
I read it has advanced imaging or diversity.Is advanced imaging similar to Rapidmix mix mode?

(21-Jun-2021, 04:29 PM)Rob3ddd Wrote: Does Fusion have two modes like Rapidmix?
I read it has advanced imaging or diversity.Is advanced imaging similar to Rapidmix mix mode?

The answer is to both questions is yes. The TBS Fusion module does image combining just like RapidFIRE and a load of modules already out there. RapidFIRE was the first module to implement such technology. The TBS Fusion module has a mode call "Oldschool" which just switches it to standard diversity mode. In fact I believe all of the image combining modules currently out there have the ability to switch between image combining and standard diversity modes.