<laughing> I have 5 pairs of reading glasses, all over the house. I will try the piggyback method.

I wonder where you get +6.00 reading glasses. The strongest I see at the usual stores is +3.25.

(16-Jan-2024, 01:28 AM)segler999 Wrote: I just got a jewelers loupe to try out.

I have one of the double lense glasses type with 25x mag on it. Perfect for examining stuff after soldering, but for use while soldering i tend to use +3.5 reading glasses and if I need it a large magnifying glass. But it's weird soldering while looking through a magnifying glass, but quite possible.

I have a semi on topic question. So TBS apparently sell flux in syringes and it isn't that expensive. So the strange things is the code on it. NC-559-ASM-UV. That code is the same one Amtech use. Is this flux rebranded Amtech flux? It also happens to be the flux (code) that the guy on that video I posted on the other thread recommended. AMS not TF.

https://www.team-blacksheep.com/products/prod:tbs_flux

(16-Jan-2024, 06:15 AM)segler999 Wrote: <laughing> I have 5 pairs of reading glasses, all over the house.  I will try the piggyback method.

I wonder where you get +6.00 reading glasses.  The strongest I see at the usual stores is +3.25.

Ebay. I found many Chinese suppliers selling up to +6.0 strength reading glasses. I need to buy some now. But also I still need a better soldering iron with decent tips.

(16-Jan-2024, 06:15 AM)segler999 Wrote: <laughing> I have 5 pairs of reading glasses, all over the house.  I will try the piggyback method.

I wonder where you get +6.00 reading glasses.  The strongest I see at the usual stores is +3.25.

Hi Segler,

Sounds like me.    I have no less than 4 or 5 different strength of
reading glasses on my desk/work bench, a couple of pair in the garage,
a pair (or two) extra in each car, and then there are the 2 pair that I carry
and use all the time. 

On the desk (that I use as a work bench), I have 3+, 4+, and 6+.
Also you CAN double them up which works better than one might
think. Now, I only do this for a short term solution since it is quite
cumbersome wearing 2 pair at the same time.

I also have a digital microscope similar to This One which is good
for checking, but I find it a bit difficult to solder with.

I have thought about buying one of these jeweler headsets to use
as a "second" overlay set rather than two pair of glasses.

I have two sources where I buy reading glasses; the first and primary 
source is (of course) Amazon; the other is a local flea market.

6+ Reading Glasses on Amazon  and  Heavier 6+ on Amazon

These are but two of many. 

Later, iFly  

(14-Jan-2024, 02:46 AM)Suros Wrote: I tend to solder at 370C, unless it's a really thick ground or a battery terminal, in which case I'll crank to 410C. A fast heating will help get things molten before the board gets time to leech heat into the surrounding components. If I needed prolonged contact, I'll blow on the part after I finish a solder joint. So far, I've only ever killed one part, and that was a regulator with a really stubborn ground on it.

Thanks for information

Consider that it is actually "time on the pad" that dissipates heat 
through out the board. Now, I realize that I have quite a bit of time 
(decades) of soldering, however, I have not (so far, fingers crossed) 
damaged a component and have not lifted a pad. If it takes longer 
than a couple of seconds, something is not going right, I remove 
the heat.

A good method to use with pads to ensure that the pad does
not get too hot is to have the solder touching the pad BEFORE
touching the iron to the pad. When the pad heats up to the
melting point of the solder, the solder will melt and flow over 
the pad. Depending on the solder, this will either be 183C degrees 
or about 188-190 C degrees. Either way it will be less than 200 C
degrees. So, what ever temp the iron is set at is NOT what the
pad temperature reaches unless, of course, the iron is left on the 
pad. Keep in mind that if the solder does NOT melt, then the pad
temperature is less than 183 C degrees. It should only take a second 
or two with the iron actually on the pad. If it takes longer than
that, remove the iron, step back, and relax as something is
not right. 

With a heavier material such as a wire, the iron can be applied
first, then the solder, but with small pads, touch the solder first.

Of course, pre-tin the pad and the wire BEFORE performing the 
actual join process. If both pieces are pre-tinned, the connection
will take place at the melting point of the solder which is either
183 C degrees or 188-190 C degrees. When the solder on the
pad begins to melt, the wire will sink into that solder on the pad, 
remove the heat, but hold the wire until the joint solidifies.

I have heard some say that the entire solder ball down to the
pad needs to be molten, however in reality, it does not. Once 
the top portion of the solder on the pad becomes soft enough
to mix with the molten solder on the wire, the wire will sink
into that solder. That is sufficient. Remove the heat. 

In cases where, the pad is super tiny, then it is a bit more
challenging and the iron only method is used, but it is 
much harder to judge how hot the pad is. Now, one must
rely on timing and enough experience to "know" about
how long it should take. Keep in mind, less time is better
as long as the pad tins. Use plenty of flux. Here is where
knowing one's equipment and being consistent is very
beneficial. 

The temperature of the pad (or what ever material) does not
instantly become the temperature of the iron; it takes time 
as it is a heat transfer process. The hotter the iron, the less
time it takes. 

Now, let us consider a butane fired soldering iron where 
the tip temperature is really hot and the precise temperature
is not known. How does one know how hot the pad is? 
Well, the solder is used as a guide. If it doesn't melt, then
the temperature of the material is less than the melting
point of the solder (183C or 188-190C).  That is why the 
solder is touched to the pad first. 

When the iron is applied to a pad first, then knowing when
to apply the solder is really just guesswork; how long does
one leave the iron on the pad, how hot is the pad actually 
getting, and how much heat is dissipated through out the 
rest of the board. 

By the way, I always use extra flux since this removes the
oxidation and keeps the pad clean during the process. Yes,
oxidation impleads the bonding process. Yeah, the rosin in
the core of the solder is often not sufficient especially for
material of any size. 

One thing that I like about keeping the iron at a given 
temperature and not changing it form this to that for 
different jobs, is that it is consistent. Yeah, one gets 
comfortable knowing how it will perform. Consequently,
I use a "hot" iron, get in and out quickly, and it works
regardless of the size of material that I am heating.

It is almost like riding a horse. One gets a "feel" for
how the thing will behave, what to expect, and how
to handle it. 

So, how hot should the iron be? Well, I guess that depends.
Very truly, it depends more on the technique that the person
uses. When the solder-before-iron method is used, what ever 
one is comfortable with since the pad will likely not get much
above 200 C degrees anyway. The hotter the iron, the faster 
this will happen. 

Many folks say 350 C to 375 C degrees, except for larger
things, then they move up to 400+ C degrees. Also, they
often change tips in the iron. This is very likely the most 
common recommendation.

Personally, I like consistency and I don't like fiddling with
the iron temperature or the tip for that matter. Maybe I 
am a bit lazy. Also, I do use a cheap 60W AC iron so it is 
just possible that the actual temp is different than what
the adjustment wheel indicates, but it does get really hot 
when set at 425 C degrees (and taped) and is consistent 
regardless of the actual temperature. It just works. Now, 
I do pay attention to the solder and how it melts. I also 
pay attention to how long it takes a pad to heat up to the 
solder's melting point. 

(16-Jan-2024, 05:08 PM)fethiye Wrote: Thanks for information

It's worth noting that I later grabbed a thermal camera and found that my $40 Pinecil iron was actually only reaching like 230C when set to 370C. Even so, it does a nice job like that.

(24-Jan-2024, 02:52 PM)Suros Wrote: It's worth noting that I later grabbed a thermal camera and found that my $40 Pinecil iron was actually only reaching like 230C when set to 370C. Even so, it does a nice job like that.

I bet there are a lot of other "China special" soldering irons that are the same. I should probably invest in a thermal camera too because they do have some good uses, but the decent (non China special) ones aren't particularly cheap.

kazowee what a mouthful:

Etekcity Infrared Thermometer Laser Temperature Gun 774, Digital IR Meat Thermometer for Cooking, Pizza Oven Grill Accessories, Heat Gun for Outdoor Surface, Indoor Room HVAC Temp Reader
https://www.amazon.com/Etekcity-Thermome...B0B71HFH9K

...but more affordable than a drooled for pretty pic thermal cam...

(24-Jan-2024, 04:35 PM)skywanderer Wrote: kazowee what a mouthful:

Etekcity Infrared Thermometer Laser Temperature Gun 774, Digital IR Meat Thermometer for Cooking, Pizza Oven Grill Accessories, Heat Gun for Outdoor Surface, Indoor Room HVAC Temp Reader
https://www.amazon.com/Etekcity-Thermome...B0B71HFH9K

...but more affordable than a drooled for pretty pic thermal cam...

Hi Skywanderer,

Yeah, it is a mouthful, but if it helps someone, then it is worth
the effort. 

Thanks for the link, I think that I might just get one of those.

Now, I am curious as the actual temperature of my soldering iron.
On the one hand, it would be interesting to know just how hot my
iron is actually getting. On the other hand, the point is that it
gets well sufficiently hot and is well above the melting point of
solder. 

Perhaps we don't always "Really" know the temperature of our iron. 
This is a solid argument for using the solder as a guide; always. If 
the solder doesn't melt, then the iron is not hot enough, if it does, 
then it is. 

Although the most common response to marginal soldering seems to
be: Use (more) Flux and Use more heat; I notice that the pads do not
appear to be pre-tinned because you can see some of the exposed pad
that does not have solder on it. When properly tinned, the entire pad
should be covered with solder. Maybe this is actually the issue. 

When I get a new spool of solder, I fire up the iron and tin the tip just to
see how the solder melts and flows. Next, tin a piece of decent size of
scrap wire (maybe 16 AWG or even 14 AWG), just to see how well it flows
through the wire and check the final result for "shininess". Since I only
buy good quality solder, this normally goes well. If I do get a bad batch,
then it will show up here; before I try to use it on a live project.

As long as the iron is hot enough to melt the solder all should go well. 

Later, iFly  

Its very simple.

I went to buddies place to build him a 18650 pack.
He has a pointy $9 iron. There was a LOT of cursing.
I drove to get my TS100. But his power supply is 12V 2.5A. MORE cursing.

Goal of soldering is to heat pad (NOT solder), so it draws in solder. But heat oxidizes the metal and solder.

The thicker fatter the tip, clean and tinned, the better the heat transfer.

If tip is black oxidized or no flux or heat quickly soaked because only 25W.. you will have a bad time. mkay.