So, being in Europe (meaning five33 frames are virtually impossible to get - unless one is happy to wait a month for a Chinese made clone) I stupidly decided to try a locally made 5in racing frame called "Wild Frog Dew 5" that looked good in pictures and was described as "fitting both 30x30 and 20x20 stacks". Also I liked the drawings and it seemed to have enough space for my chosen ESC(long story short it doesn't).

I decided to get a Foxeer Reaper Slim Mini 60A 20x20 ESC. It should've fitted as it is 41mm,and the frame is supposed to have 41.5mm of space, but the esc has its 20x20 screws offset about 1.5mm to the front(which I didn't realise). So it needs about 44mm of space in the frame.

An obvious solution would be to mount it sideways with the battery lead on the side. But that would mean a good 6mm (quarter inch) of a pcb would hang out of the frame on both sides which doesn't inspire confidence in it's ability to survive many crashes.

Has anyone tried putting their esc sideways on a racing frame? Has it lasted more than till the first crash?

Another option is to file the 20x20 mounting holes into slots by about 2mm towards the front. I could do that. Then the esc would fit, but also the frame hasn't got 41.5mm of space as it should. It has barely 41. So if the mounting holes for the stack are relocated the esc is still essentially a friction fit between the standoffs making any rubber mounting useless. In case of a hard crash the force from frame standoffs would get transferred directly to the pcb.

What would you do? I'm leaning towards sending the "fits both 20x20 and 30x30 stacks" frame back to get my money back and waiting a month for a Chinese knockoff of five33 switchback to arrive.

How likely is a crash force to dislocate metal standoffs and crush a pcb that is a tight fit between them?

on the side between the arms, next to the body; its very very unusual to get damge there.

many race frames was puristic in the past, just a tiny carbon strap on top, much less protection.
i was scared by that either at first, but i never had an issue.

thight fit between the standoffs is a much higher risk than a few mm outside of the frame.

force to the top and bended standoffs is way more likely than force from the side, i would prior enough space between standoff and board.


where are you located? many good frames and shops in europe.

(28-Feb-2024, 11:04 AM)hugnosed_bat Wrote: on the side between the arms, next to the body; its very very unusual to get damge there.

many race frames was puristic in the past, just a tiny carbon strap on top, much less protection.
i was scared by that either at first, but i never had an issue.

thight fit between the standoffs is a much higher risk than a few mm outside of the frame.

force to the top and bended standoffs is way more likely than force from the side, i would prior enough space between standoff and board.


where are you located? many good frames and shops in europe.

Thank you for letting me know. I was considering modifying the frame (moving the stack mounting holes slightly), but as you say touching the standoffs is much worse than extending to sides I'd either have to make standoffs with a chunk taken out where the esc is, and made them thicker at the same time(I have access to a machine shop, but is it worth the effort?). Perhaps I will mount is sideways as you say.

I'm in Poland, I'm happy to buy from anywhere within EU with good cheap postal service(sorry Italy) where they accept PayPal. When I look for stuff I usually start locally in Poland, then Germany, Holland, France, Spain. I used to buy lots of stuff from the UK, but since Brexit it has been easier to get stuff from China than the UK,so I avoid buying from the UK.

If you know of any shop selling five33 switchback (or lightswitch if anyone knows the actual internal dimensions) around here please do let me know. Or if you can recommend an alternative 5in true x racing frame with 5mm arms,please do.

Also, what is it with racing frame manufacturer's not showing you info about exact internal dimensions? It would be so much easier for everyone if they showed actual dimension drawings. For example. I imagine my esc will fit five33 switchback, but I have no way of knowing if it will. I found one guy on reddit that claims his Foxeer Reaper Slim Mini was a very tight fit.

So, I decided to modify the frame by milling the stack mounting holes into slots and filing the ESC pcb to make it very slightly smaller. It fits now with about half a mm spare space.

I did that yesterday and just today I got a five33 switchback clone from China 3 weeks early... Now I can use five33, but I can no longer return the previous frame. So I might just keep using it and leave five33 for the next build.

It gives me a good opportunity to compare both frames and I have to say... If this locally made Wild Frog Dew 5 was let's say 6mm longer I'd say I prefer it from the five33 switchback. Why? Because it remains lightweight while giving you 4 motor bolts, it provides better camera protection (carbon on the sides of the camera), and there is less air resistance due to smaller cross section. In favour of the switchback I can count better esc compatibility and better stack protection in case of a crash that bends posts.

In 2022, Orqa (in Croatia) became the official Five33 distributor on the European continent, so any genuine Five33 frames and parts can be purchased from them, but the shipping prices they charge are obscene. Whenever I've looked they have had limited stock (which I assume gets periodically sent over from their USA warehouse), but I see right now that Orqa are listing all of the racing frames as being out of stock. I think the racers must just buy them all up whenever they become available.

I was lucky enough to purchase a Five33 Switchback HD frame a couple of years ago at a 40% discount when Five33 were shutting down their original European warehouse before moving their European operation to be under Orqa's management, but with extortionate shipping costs the price still ended up being about the same as one purchased in my own country, had any vendors had stock, which they didn't. So I didn't really save anything, but it was the only place I could find one outside of the USA. Buying stuff from the USA isn't really viable due to the additional VAT and import taxes which get charged on any parcels coming into the country.

Be careful about modifying FC and ESC boards by filing them down. Sometimes multi-layered boards have traces running close to the edge on the internal layers that you can't see, and some even have copper planes running through or around the mounting holes. People on here have destroyed perfectly good boards in the past by inadvertently filing through some of the electrical traces while trying to make the board a bit smaller.

While agreeing with Snow on making baords smaller, I have used a very high brightness light with cardboard mask round the board so I could see tracks etc when I looked through the PCB transluscent material. I did this last with some transponders I needed to lighten.

Thank you for good tips.

This esc unfortunately uses black soldermask so there is no looking through it.

I had a look with a microscope, there aren't any traces visible from the edge so I think I'm good.

I'm still a little torn between these two frames :-D At the moment the switchback is winning as long as I can get the wide top plate (for hdzero race vtx).

What about a cranked side plate shield attached to the posts? Look at the Diatone Roma for appearance.

(01-Mar-2024, 08:52 AM)Luk5569 Wrote: I'm still a little torn between these two frames :-D At the moment the switchback is winning as long as I can get the wide top plate (for hdzero race vtx).

DroneIt in Sweden claim to have some Switchback Pro HDZero top plates in stock, but just like Orqa their shipping costs to other European countries seems to be excessive (twice the price of the actual top plate itself just for shipping), so it would only make sense to buy from them if you were also buying other stuff as well to make the shipping costs financially viable...

https://droneit.se/product/flyfive33-swi...protection

RC-Hangar15 also have some but it's not clear if they ship outside of Germany or what the cost is if they do...

https://shop.rc-hangar15.de/FIVE33-Switc...-Top-Plate

(01-Mar-2024, 01:12 PM)SnowLeopardFPV Wrote: DroneIt in Sweden claim to have some Switchback Pro HDZero top plates in stock, but just like Orqa their shipping costs to other European countries seems to be excessive (twice the price of the actual top plate itself just for shipping), so it would only make sense to buy from them if you were also buying other stuff as well to make the shipping costs financially viable...

https://droneit.se/product/flyfive33-swi...protection

RC-Hangar15 also have some but it's not clear if they ship outside of Germany or what the cost is if they do...

https://shop.rc-hangar15.de/FIVE33-Switc...-Top-Plate

Thanks. However as you said shipping from Sweden is very expensive for some reason (20 EUR to Poland, a neighboring country, seriously?) and rc-hangar15.de doesn't ship anywhere outside Germany. I'm not sure why. Here is what they say. 

* No more deliveries to other EU countries or third countries in compliance with the EU Anti-Geoblocking Regulation (VO (EU) No. 2018/302)
As an EU foreign customer, you can order in the RC-Hangar15 online shop and either provide us with a delivery address in Germany or collect the goods directly from our store: Embachweg 15, 35463 Fernwald, Germany. Delivery to another EU country or third country is not possible.
Under the EU Anti-Geoblocking Regulation (VO (EU) No. 2018/302), online retailers are still permitted to independently define their delivery area and decide for themselves which EU countries they want to deliver to. Although the regulation obliges retailers to allow contracts to be concluded with customers throughout the EU, this does not automatically establish a right to delivery to the customer's destination country. Rather, if shipping is not offered, the customer must choose either a delivery address in the retailer's delivery area or - if offered by the retailer - self-collection.

Note their creative interpretation of the EU non-geoblocking law that was established to essentially force all internet retailers to ship EU wide. In practice it works like this: if you ship outside your home country - you have to ship everywhere within the EU, you can't pick and choose countries to ship to. But if you only ship to your own country that's fine. 

(01-Mar-2024, 08:56 AM)BadRaven Wrote: What about a cranked side plate shield attached to the posts?  Look at the Diatone Roma for appearance.

This is actually a pretty good idea. Thanks :-)

you are right its a shame, any proprietary rc car has an explosen-draw. but you might gave the reason by buying a clone, they want to sell at least one frame and give them the work of mesuring until they can do a clone

dont expect to get the same sort of frame by the same shape on a clone. carbon quality and direction of fibers does generaly not match on cloned, clones doesnt try to gain reputation with quality, they just imitate an original let people expect the same but are a lower quality commonly.

back than there was the board mount standarts, for some time a 20x20mm board did stay inside of a 30x30mm diameter. it changed when 20x20mm boards get popular for 5inch, some manufacturers just changed their layouts and mounting an didnt shrink truly.
both escs i use, the hw 20x20mm and the aikon arent truly small in everyway, i needed to do some research either compare the board dimensions of examples on rotorbuilds on that frame with the diameter of my boards did work for me backthan.

(01-Mar-2024, 11:27 PM)hugnosed_bat Wrote: you are right its a shame, any proprietary rc car has an explosen-draw. but you might gave the reason by buying a clone, they want to sell at least one frame and give them the work of mesuring until they can do a clone

dont expect to get the same sort of frame by the same shape on a clone. carbon quality and direction of fibers does generaly not match on cloned, clones doesnt try to gain reputation with quality, they just imitate an original let people expect the same but are a lower quality commonly.

back than there was the board mount standarts, for some time a 20x20mm board did stay inside of a 30x30mm diameter. it changed when 20x20mm boards get popular for 5inch, some manufacturers just changed their layouts and mounting an didnt shrink truly.
both escs i use, the hw 20x20mm and the aikon arent truly small in everyway, i needed to do some research either compare the board dimensions of examples on rotorbuilds on that frame with the diameter of my boards did work for me backthan.

Hmm, maybe you're right they do it to slow clone makers.

Regarding clone quality, I've bought 7 frames since I started in this hobby. 3 are clones and 4 are genuine (Speedybee Mario 5, foxeer Caesar 5 and two locally made 5in frames advertised as using "Toray carbon" - i forgot which exact one). I cannot tell the difference between them in terms of quality.

Also, alongside the switchback I ordered something called "533 plus" which turned out to be a clone of lightswitch v2. Lightswitch v2 has very precisely milled arm mounting and comes with a file in case the clearance isn't enough. My clone arrived with a file too, but all 4 arms can be retained just by the "keystone plate" with no filing. Also I can use its top plate instead of the switchback one to better protect my hdzero race vtx.

Perhaps it is luck, or I'm good choosing sellers on Aliexpress... (I never buy from the cheapest guy, I check the seller sold lots of the item and reviews are good).

Then there is morality of buying clones. If I can buy the original I buy the original, but unless one buys from the manufacturer (like Speedybee) there is no certainty one is not buying a clone priced like the original.