Posts: 41 Threads: 4 Likes Received: 1 in 1 posts Likes Given: 2 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 27-Mar-2017, 03:04 AM (This post was last modified: 27-Mar-2017, 02:35 PM by Nathaniel52441.) Just got a syma X11 back in December and got a small fpv rig on it. I enjoyed it but now I'm looking to build my own quad with 8.5mm motors for more punch. I've read countless forums and blogs but I can't seem to find any current opinions on FC's for micro quad. Preferably something with built in esc's. Any help would be greatly appreciated! • Posts: 2,286 Threads: 38 Likes Received: 1,527 in 995 posts Likes Given: 1,881 Joined: Apr 2016 Reputation: 72 If you are going to build something with brushed motors, you don't need any ESCs. An ESC is used to control a brushless motor. There are a whole bunch of F3 based brushed flight controllers on Banggood. • Posts: 91 Threads: 10 Likes Received: 84 in 45 posts Likes Given: 105 Joined: Aug 2016 Reputation: 2 Look at the FuriousFPV Nuke - used one on a 8.5mm motor build and think it's far better than the Micro SciSky board I also have... http://intofpv.com/t-90mm-cf-frame-8520-nuke-microrx • Posts: 65 Threads: 3 Likes Received: 36 in 20 posts Likes Given: 6 Joined: Feb 2017 Reputation: 1 27-Mar-2017, 01:47 PM (This post was last modified: 27-Mar-2017, 02:03 PM by Helibus.) I went through this same transition within the last couple of months. The most important factor is to look for a FC specifically for brushed motors. Yeah, it can be confusing. I've read product descriptions for brushed controllers that say they have built-in or on-board ESCs. Some additional factors... Where are you willing to buy from? Are you in a rush and want to buy fairly locally, or can you wait for an order from a place like Banggood? FC stock seems to ebb and flow, and this could impact your selection. Have you selected a particular frame? If so, figure out what FC options will mount to it. They're not all the same size. What are you planning to use for a Tx/Rx combination? You need to make sure the FC supports whatever you have or plan to have for a receiver. I'll stick my neck out and suggest that processor performance isn't that big of a deal on a brushed controller. There's even still a small but active Alien/MultiWii community building brushed boards using 8-bit ATMEGA processors running at something like 8 MHz or 16 MHz. Multi Motor Warehouse sells it. Going with a FC with an integrated receiver would save weight and wiring hassles. What I opted for on my first FPV quad build was a Scisky FC. The most common one found for sale are F1 processor boards with a Spektrum DSMX compatible receiver. Versions compatible with five or so other transmitters, as well as versions with F3 processors are available directly from overskyrc. Overskyrc also sells the scisky FC already integrated with their VTX solution, although it's more expensive than adding your own all-in-one VTX/camera block. • Posts: 41 Threads: 4 Likes Received: 1 in 1 posts Likes Given: 2 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 From my understanding when they say brushed boards have "esc" they actually mean that have a mosfet capable of X amps. Correct? • Posts: 41 Threads: 4 Likes Received: 1 in 1 posts Likes Given: 2 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 Helibus, shipping times aren't very important to me, I plan on building this over the course of a month of so. For a frame I'm looking at a MI110 110mm carbon frame on banggood. I still haven't figured out the TX/RX combo, I'm still trying to sort out the pros and cons of each protocol. Thanks for the replies! • Posts: 65 Threads: 3 Likes Received: 36 in 20 posts Likes Given: 6 Joined: Feb 2017 Reputation: 1 (27-Mar-2017, 02:08 PM)Nathaniel52441 Wrote: From my understanding when they say brushed boards have "esc" they actually mean that have a mosfet capable of X amps. Correct? Well, yeah. I just take the on-board ESC description to mean the listing is referring to ESC as the electronic speed control function. After all, it *does* leverage electronics, and it *does* control the motor speed. Where unseen is coming from is that ESC has a pretty clear connotation in the RC world that involves (usually separate) hardware interpreting a digital timing signal from the controller and converting it to pulse trains for driving the three legs of a brushless motor, also using MOSFETs as the final drivers. (27-Mar-2017, 02:15 PM)Nathaniel52441 Wrote: ...For a frame I'm looking at a MI110 110mm carbon frame on banggood.... I bought that same frame on one of my banggood orders, but haven't done anything with it yet. Looks like a reasonable frame. I have all the parts (including an F3 scisky from getFPV) to build a second brushed quad, but I'm going to use this Nano-QX like frame on eBay instead of the MI110. It's not a sturdy frame, but it'll give me at least some propeller protection for indoors that my 115mm 3D printed quad doesn't have. • Posts: 41 Threads: 4 Likes Received: 1 in 1 posts Likes Given: 2 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 (27-Mar-2017, 04:27 PM)Helibus Wrote: Well, yeah. I just take the on-board ESC description to mean the listing is referring to ESC as the electronic speed control function. After all, it *does* leverage electronics, and it *does* control the motor speed. Where unseen is coming from is that ESC has a pretty clear connotation in the RC world that involves (usually separate) hardware interpreting a digital timing signal from the controller and converting it to pulse trains for driving the three legs of a brushless motor, also using MOSFETs as the final drivers. I bought that same frame on one of my banggood orders, but haven't done anything with it yet. Looks like a reasonable frame. I have all the parts (including an F3 scisky from getFPV) to build a second brushed quad, but I'm going to use this Nano-QX like frame on eBay instead of the MI110. It's not a sturdy frame, but it'll give me at least some propeller protection for indoors that my 115mm 3D printed quad doesn't have. Thanks for clearing up the ESC confusion, I had a hard time finding a definite answer. That looks like an awesome indoor frame! I'm not super concerned with the guard since I fly outside a lot but for an indoor build id definitely consider using it! I plan on build a 250mm brushless quad after I get the hang of quad building. Any input on a preferred tx/rx protocol? • Posts: 41 Threads: 4 Likes Received: 1 in 1 posts Likes Given: 2 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 27-Mar-2017, 05:31 PM (This post was last modified: 27-Mar-2017, 05:48 PM by Nathaniel52441.) (27-Mar-2017, 01:34 PM)jimbo_wa Wrote: Look at the FuriousFPV Nuke - used one on a 8.5mm motor build and think it's far better than the Micro SciSky board I also have... http://intofpv.com/t-90mm-cf-frame-8520-nuke-microrx I actually looked at that FC a few days back but wasn't sure if it'd work for my needs since it doesn't have OSD (something I'd like to have) and since it's such a small quad I didn't know if the added weight of an external rx plus OSD and VTX would be too much for a brushed quad. (Edit) Did a little reading and I'm getting the impression the OSD is overkill for such a small quad considering it's only going short distances outdoors. • Posts: 65 Threads: 3 Likes Received: 36 in 20 posts Likes Given: 6 Joined: Feb 2017 Reputation: 1 (27-Mar-2017, 05:27 PM)Nathaniel52441 Wrote: I plan on build a 250mm brushless quad after I get the hang of quad building. Any input on a preferred tx/rx protocol? IMO the specific protocol isn't that important. I'd worry about what TX you want, based on how much you can afford and the features needed. Or, go with something simple for now that will likely need to be replaced if you continue in the hobby. If you want to get a TX now that will serve you for the long haul, go for as many channels as you can afford. Even a 250 can require a handful of channels for odds and ends like LED control, a buzzer that you can turn on when retrieving a lost quad, mode changes and in-flight tuning. I've had a 6-channel DX6i since my early days of flying helicopters and it's going to be holding me back until I decide I really want to spend the money on a new, more capable Tx. The DX6i doesn't have three-position switches or potentiometers that most if not all FC firmwares take for granted. The Taranis X9D would probably win a popularity contest, but because it is so flexible it can be a whole project in itself getting it configured. (27-Mar-2017, 05:31 PM)Nathaniel52441 Wrote: Did a little reading and I'm getting the impression the OSD is overkill for such a small quad considering it's only going short distances outdoors. I'm just a basic small-quad yard flyer but I think the main reason people want OSD is for real time monitoring of the battery voltage to ensure the flight ends with an acceptable charge remaining in the battery, regardless of how aggressive the flight was. Brushless motors can draw a lot of current, so this gets to be important with them, especially as the motors get bigger. Your only other option is to fly with a timer. Whether a timer is adequate on your brushed quad depends on how consistently you fly from flight to flight, and whether or not you want to squeeze every possible second of flight time that you can. • Posts: 41 Threads: 4 Likes Received: 1 in 1 posts Likes Given: 2 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 (27-Mar-2017, 08:02 PM)Helibus Wrote: IMO the specific protocol isn't that important. I'd worry about what TX you want, based on how much you can afford and the features needed. Or, go with something simple for now that will likely need to be replaced if you continue in the hobby. If you want to get a TX now that will serve you for the long haul, go for as many channels as you can afford. Even a 250 can require a handful of channels for odds and ends like LED control, a buzzer that you can turn on when retrieving a lost quad, mode changes and in-flight tuning. I've had a 6-channel DX6i since my early days of flying helicopters and it's going to be holding me back until I decide I really want to spend the money on a new, more capable Tx. The DX6i doesn't have three-position switches or potentiometers that most if not all FC firmwares take for granted. The Taranis X9D would probably win a popularity contest, but because it is so flexible it can be a whole project in itself getting it configured. I'm just a basic small-quad yard flyer but I think the main reason people want OSD is for real time monitoring of the battery voltage to ensure the flight ends with an acceptable charge remaining in the battery, regardless of how aggressive the flight was. Brushless motors can draw a lot of current, so this gets to be important with them, especially as the motors get bigger. Your only other option is to fly with a timer. Whether a timer is adequate on your brushed quad depends on how consistently you fly from flight to flight, and whether or not you want to squeeze every possible second of flight time that you can. I was looking at the taranis qx7 for a tx, seems to be the most decent for price vs features. Is there any way to set a low voltage shut off in clean flight? similar to what the syma X11 has where it just slowly lowers to the ground rather than doing a full shut off and falling from the sky. • Posts: 65 Threads: 3 Likes Received: 36 in 20 posts Likes Given: 6 Joined: Feb 2017 Reputation: 1 I thought about mentioning the QX7. It does provide quite a value. I was close to ordering one when it was first available, but it went out of stock too quick. Now I've been waffling on whether 7 channels is really enough. As a minimum, I'll wait for a while to help ensure any initial production issues get resolved. Another option I had been looking at before the QX7 came out was a Devo 10 running open source Deviation firmware. On the battery voltage question, I'm not aware of CF being able to gracefully land with low voltage. CF does have low voltage detection, but as I understand it all it can do is turn on a buzzer that you are supposed to notice, should your FC and quad be equipped with one. • Posts: 2,416 Threads: 51 Likes Received: 1,861 in 1,175 posts Likes Given: 3,315 Joined: Mar 2016 Reputation: 74 (27-Mar-2017, 09:23 PM)Helibus Wrote: I thought about mentioning the QX7. It does provide quite a value. I was close to ordering one when it was first available, but it went out of stock too quick. Now I've been waffling on whether 7 channels is really enough. As a minimum, I'll wait for a while to help ensure any initial production issues get resolved. Another option I had been looking at before the QX7 came out was a Devo 10 running open source Deviation firmware. Q X7 is 16 channel I believe... • Posts: 65 Threads: 3 Likes Received: 36 in 20 posts Likes Given: 6 Joined: Feb 2017 Reputation: 1 (27-Mar-2017, 10:16 PM)sloscotty Wrote: Q X7 is 16 channel I believe... You're right. Man, now I wonder where I got the seven channel idea from. Thanks for correcting my error. • Posts: 41 Threads: 4 Likes Received: 1 in 1 posts Likes Given: 2 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 (27-Mar-2017, 09:23 PM)Helibus Wrote: I thought about mentioning the QX7. It does provide quite a value. I was close to ordering one when it was first available, but it went out of stock too quick. Now I've been waffling on whether 7 channels is really enough. As a minimum, I'll wait for a while to help ensure any initial production issues get resolved. Another option I had been looking at before the QX7 came out was a Devo 10 running open source Deviation firmware. On the battery voltage question, I'm not aware of CF being able to gracefully land with low voltage. CF does have low voltage detection, but as I understand it all it can do is turn on a buzzer that you are supposed to notice, should your FC and quad be equipped with one. I'm gonna take a deeper look into the qx7, I've never done anything RC before so the TX configuration will be completely new to me. I work in IT so I'm sure I'll be able to figure it out with a little fiddling. Any other opinions on Brushed FC's? I like the Nuke a lot but it's lacking a few features I want. If it's the best I can find I'll probably pull the trigger on it though. • |