Posts: 139 Threads: 19 Likes Received: 34 in 26 posts Likes Given: 9 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 24-Mar-2017, 06:25 PM (This post was last modified: 24-Mar-2017, 06:27 PM by nitro20%.) so before i go off....HELLO fpvers...im from a small town and me and my son fly solo..no info, except internet...im not new to FPV, but, i have a full time job so when i get home there new firmware to update..to much to keep up with...i cant even take a nap with out something changing..lol..but yeah..noob to this site...im not a forum chat site whore either..lol..but i am finding out that i need to keep up with some things or im going to end up with a tone of out dated shit that nobody would even build a basher out of..lol ....soo now that i broke the ice or some shit..?? im about to change every quad i have to these 30a tiny beauties. bought 4 to power emaxs new 2306s.(found a store in a small town has a bunch, bought 6, 2400kv).. ..but before i do...its hard to believe that 30A is in such a small package..is there any info on testing.....but then again look at emax.. other companies are gonna have to re-invent the wheel to even smell the tire smoke coming from emaxs progress. but are these tiny things the emax we are seeing today? will they last? • Posts: 2,416 Threads: 51 Likes Received: 1,861 in 1,175 posts Likes Given: 3,315 Joined: Mar 2016 Reputation: 74 24-Mar-2017, 06:37 PM (This post was last modified: 24-Mar-2017, 06:40 PM by sloscotty.) Welcome nitro! Lots of good stuff here - and none of it is sh*t. I know you'll appreciate that. • Posts: 139 Threads: 19 Likes Received: 34 in 26 posts Likes Given: 9 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 (24-Mar-2017, 06:37 PM)sloscotty Wrote: Welcome nitro! Lots of good stuff here - and none of it is sh*t. I know you'll appreciate that. so alls im really lookin for is a esc thats 30a and isnt like mounting 4 cell phones to the arms of my quad..these emax bulllet 30a...are so small...have seen or heard if they are holding up. im in the shopping mood today. im NOT lookin for "the best" thing out there...lol. With dshot and multi shot, Ill never be able to see/feel the difference to any other....like i said i bought 4..but no need to try every esc out there if there is one esc i can use for everything i have..im about to buy 16 of these things!!! lol.. • Posts: 2,416 Threads: 51 Likes Received: 1,861 in 1,175 posts Likes Given: 3,315 Joined: Mar 2016 Reputation: 74 Looks like Amazon has a few sets of 4: https://www.amazon.com/Crazepony-BLheli-...B01MZ6OWKV Banggood expects stock on April 2: http://www.banggood.com/Emax-EMX-SC-1774...15126.html I don't know anything about these, but they look pretty good. Please give them a test and write up a review for us... • Posts: 1,773 Threads: 30 Likes Received: 1,199 in 755 posts Likes Given: 714 Joined: Oct 2016 Reputation: 45 All the new ESCs are tiny. I've got DYS XSD 30amps that are this size and they can handle 100 amp bursts no problem. • Posts: 139 Threads: 19 Likes Received: 34 in 26 posts Likes Given: 9 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 (24-Mar-2017, 08:34 PM)RENOV8R Wrote: All the new ESCs are tiny. I've got DYS XSD 30amps that are this size and they can handle 100 amp bursts no problem. ??? i just got the 20a xs dys..and they are 2Xs the size of the emax bullet i just got...the bullet is 19.?mm X 11.?mm. the measurements for dys 30 amp xsd where like 30mm...huge..at 19mm you could put 30a on a 130mm frame haha.. they run dshot and mutishot..no upgrades.. and thats what im asking is if these tiny 30ampers can handle all the power we are wanting to give our motors? • Posts: 1,773 Threads: 30 Likes Received: 1,199 in 755 posts Likes Given: 714 Joined: Oct 2016 Reputation: 45 (24-Mar-2017, 11:43 PM)nitro20% Wrote: ??? i just got the 20a xs dys..and they are 2Xs the size of the emax bullet i just got...the bullet is 19.?mm X 11.?mm. the measurements for dys 30 amp xsd where like 30mm...huge..at 19mm you could put 30a on a 130mm frame haha.. they run dshot and mutishot..no upgrades.. and thats what im asking is if these tiny 30ampers can handle all the power we are wanting to give our motors? DYS are probably a little larger as they're rates for 2S-6S (not that I'd ever use more than a 4S) whereas the Emax or only rated for 2S-4S • Posts: 139 Threads: 19 Likes Received: 34 in 26 posts Likes Given: 9 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 (25-Mar-2017, 03:11 AM)RENOV8R Wrote: DYS are probably a little larger as they're rates for 2S-6S (not that I'd ever use more than a 4S) whereas the Emax or only rated for 2S-4S that would explain the size. i know right, 6s..?? i dont think ill be at 6s for a wile..i hope..lol • Posts: 139 Threads: 19 Likes Received: 34 in 26 posts Likes Given: 9 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 26-Mar-2017, 09:00 PM (This post was last modified: 26-Mar-2017, 09:01 PM by nitro20%.) (25-Mar-2017, 03:11 AM)RENOV8R Wrote: DYS are probably a little larger as they're rates for 2S-6S (not that I'd ever use more than a 4S) whereas the Emax or only rated for 2S-4S ok i watched lings vid on some 2306 emaxes...he used a 25 amp esc with like 30a burst, he used a 4s...but he said his amperage was like 42a per motor on punch outs....why didnt somthing fry....??? • Posts: 1,070 Threads: 70 Likes Received: 742 in 378 posts Likes Given: 577 Joined: Jan 2016 Reputation: 44 26-Mar-2017, 10:02 PM (This post was last modified: 26-Mar-2017, 10:03 PM by KonradS. Edit Reason: typos ) (26-Mar-2017, 09:00 PM)nitro20% Wrote: ok i watched lings vid on some 2306 emaxes...he used a 25 amp esc with like 30a burst, he used a 4s...but he said his amperage was like 42a per motor on punch outs....why didnt somthing fry....??? And I did a 52A test on a thrust stand while using a 35A ESC and everything survived (EMAX RS2205S, 4s, racekraft 5051) 30A is a 10s burst rating that is considered safe by the manufacturer - no one said that we can't push the limits. It is not amps that kill ESCs, heat is - ergo too many Watts. If anyone would continue to fly like this for a longer time, that ESC would fry at some point. But punchouts? How long are those • Posts: 139 Threads: 19 Likes Received: 34 in 26 posts Likes Given: 9 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 28-Mar-2017, 12:57 AM (This post was last modified: 28-Mar-2017, 12:59 AM by nitro20%.) (26-Mar-2017, 10:02 PM)KonradS Wrote: And I did a 52A test on a thrust stand while using a 35A ESC and everything survived (EMAX RS2205S, 4s, racekraft 5051) 30A is a 10s burst rating that is considered safe by the manufacturer - no one said that we can't push the limits. It is not amps that kill ESCs, heat is - ergo too many Watts. If anyone would continue to fly like this for a longer time, that ESC would fry at some point. But punchouts? How long are those so you are oscar ling? i have learned so much from your reviews.. thank you so much..i live in a small town of two stop lights..i was the first person to FPV here..there are more noobs now. cluttering up the parks..lol..but everything "i think" i know has came from you or few others..never hands on, or, one on one...at times it was so tough, buying everything to see what works, especially back when there was alot of user programming to get things working properly. so thanks a bunch i know that keeping up is alot of work.. ok i get it...i was always the one to play it safe.. plus in the last few yrs ive spent so much money on things, i dont want to buy any more things to "test out". its time to fly...you know? 180 tyrant has 2600 red bottoms,4045 3 blade dal, i put 30a emax bullets on it last night..f4 flip FC, and a 3s tattu 75c 1550mah. im loveing dshot, its gonna do fine..should be set.. my other is 215 tyrant 2306 2400kv emax motors, im going with 30a emax bullets (hope its enough), and the tattu 75c 3s 1550mah bat.,5045 v2 dal 3 blade props, flip f4 FC. but NO extra cameras or anything, striped down race. so it should be lite..i think it will work.. i went from 5 quads with naze32 f1 and OLD ass ESCs to 5 quads with flip32s f4, dshot with sick ass motors in 30 days...holy sht..my pay pal is smokin..lol • Posts: 139 Threads: 19 Likes Received: 34 in 26 posts Likes Given: 9 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 (24-Mar-2017, 08:19 PM)sloscotty Wrote: Looks like Amazon has a few sets of 4: https://www.amazon.com/Crazepony-BLheli-...B01MZ6OWKV Banggood expects stock on April 2: http://www.banggood.com/Emax-EMX-SC-1774...15126.html I don't know anything about these, but they look pretty good. Please give them a test and write up a review for us... ok so..ive put the 30amper emax bullets on a 180 tyrant with 2600 red bottoms and flip32 f4 FC..with mpu-imc20608 gyro, and 3s tattu 75c 1550mah..fly's fine on stock pids, betalfight, 8k/8k. that is L.O.S.. havein an issue, landing it bounces like P is high then it freaks out.so A LONG STORY SHORT. my TX is now powered off my PDB 5v, FC is free of any power out put except buzzer..(like always,except for TX). Now, it dosent happen as often. the braking/ power surge is messing with my flip32 FC and was shutting down my RX leaving it with the last known commands for one second (too long).you know that little bounce at a landing and motors kinda twitch?. WELP it remembers FULL THROTTLE, flips OUT, fail safes, then re-boots. its fine when i punch out/up and things..seems fine when throttle is on 25% or more..flys around flips/yaw/turns.. SO. all i changed was ESCS from DYS xms30a oneshot, TO emax 30A bullets . worked fine..landed great. never touched pids. but now cant land without my FC getting back amps or volts or whatever it is,LOL, and shutting down for a split second... so now i guess i put a capacitor on?? so first thing i found was, the tiny things dont have anywhere to store that extra energy they produce when doing their things and stuff (braking), like the "bigger" ESCs...AAAHHHH...bad EMAX.... BAD... but then i do have the cheapest in cost pof the flip32 FCs? hope this is the only thing i find..i bough 9 more. i bench tested it with NO props, and although it takes a good few hard taps to malfunction, bout 15 seconds, idling motors, seems the motors are a little warm, more then warm,, too hot for me?..i was wondering, because i dint mess with pids yet..well lowered P five pitch and roll for the other esc, but thats it. i was wondering if D may be the thing to chase..what is all the extra gyro adjustments on the PID page 2 in betaflight? • Posts: 2,286 Threads: 38 Likes Received: 1,527 in 995 posts Likes Given: 1,881 Joined: Apr 2016 Reputation: 72 (29-Mar-2017, 05:11 AM)nitro20% Wrote: ok so..ive put the 30amper emax bullets on a 180 tyrant with 2600 red bottoms and flip32 f4 FC..with mpu-imc20608 gyro, and 3s tattu 75c 1550mah..fly's fine on stock pids, betalfight, 8k/8k. that is L.O.S.. havein an issue, landing it bounces like P is high then it freaks out.so A LONG STORY SHORT. my TX is now powered off my PDB 5v, FC is free of any power out put except buzzer..(like always,except for TX). Now, it dosent happen as often. Having your craft go a bit crazy when you try to land is nothing at all to do with the PID controller's P term. If you still have air mode enabled, then you will see this if you don't land promptly and try to hover too long at just a few inches above the ground. (29-Mar-2017, 05:11 AM)nitro20% Wrote: the braking/ power surge is messing with my flip32 FC and was shutting down my RX leaving it with the last known commands for one second (too long).you know that little bounce at a landing and motors kinda twitch?. WELP it remembers FULL THROTTLE, flips OUT, fail safes, then re-boots. its fine when i punch out/up and things..seems fine when throttle is on 25% or more..flys around flips/yaw/turns.. Sorry, but this makes no sense. If your RX shut down, it would not be sending any channel values at all! What is rebooting? How do you know? This still sounds like air mode interfering with your landing. I use a three-position switch for arming. The first position is disarmed, the second is armed and the third is armed + air mode. That way I can switch off air mode when I'm about to land. (29-Mar-2017, 05:11 AM)nitro20% Wrote: SO. all i changed was ESCS from DYS xms30a oneshot, TO emax 30A bullets . worked fine..landed great. never touched pids. but now cant land without my FC getting back amps or volts or whatever it is,LOL, and shutting down for a split second... so now i guess i put a capacitor on?? Again, what is it that tells you that this problem is anything to do with the motors pushing current back to the flight controller? I think you are making an assumption without having any evidence to support it. That's a really dangerous step when it comes to trying to diagnose a problem. If you have the possibility to record a black box log, then record one and post it here. We can then look at the log and see if there are any clues. Some video that goes together with the log would also be really helpful. (29-Mar-2017, 05:11 AM)nitro20% Wrote: i bench tested it with NO props, and although it takes a good few hard taps to malfunction, bout 15 seconds, idling motors, seems the motors are a little warm, more then warm,, too hot for me?..i was wondering, because i dint mess with pids yet..well lowered P five pitch and roll for the other esc, but thats it. i was wondering if D may be the thing to chase..what is all the extra gyro adjustments on the PID page 2 in betaflight? What happens after these "good few hard taps"? What are you trying to test? If your motors are getting hot on the bench, how long are you running them for? Without propellers, there's nothing cooling the motors and they will get warm. Too warm is when you can't hold a finger on the motor for more than a couple of seconds. If your motors are getting that hot on the bench then stop overheating them. If you overheat the motors too far, the magnets will start to demagnetise and your kv will start climbing. If you just fly the craft normally, are the motors really hot when you land? If so, there's a problem. If they are merely warm when you land then there isn't. Also, it's unlikely that you would need to change PID settings due to different ESCs. Maybe if you were using ESCs from 2000 and then switched to something modern, but certainly not if we are talking about modern ESCs in both cases. Nearly all my quads fly perfectly on default PIDs using the latest Betaflight. Unless you have oscillation in flight when making a hard turn or during rapid throttle changes, or a problem keeping the same attitude under acceleration, you should not need to change the PIDs. Blindly changing the PID settings without a good reason and without having a specific goal will just make more problems for you. Please understand that I'm not criticising you here; I'm trying to explain that if you have a problem, you must be structured and logical in trying to find the cause and the solution. Changing settings without good reason rarely makes things better and making assumptions will lead you down entirely the wrong path. Posts: 139 Threads: 19 Likes Received: 34 in 26 posts Likes Given: 9 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 (29-Mar-2017, 09:07 AM)unseen Wrote: Having your craft go a bit crazy when you try to land is nothing at all to do with the PID controller's P term. If you still have air mode enabled, then you will see this if you don't land promptly and try to hover too long at just a few inches above the ground. Sorry, but this makes no sense. If your RX shut down, it would not be sending any channel values at all! What is rebooting? How do you know? This still sounds like air mode interfering with your landing. I use a three-position switch for arming. The first position is disarmed, the second is armed and the third is armed + air mode. That way I can switch off air mode when I'm about to land. Again, what is it that tells you that this problem is anything to do with the motors pushing current back to the flight controller? I think you are making an assumption without having any evidence to support it. That's a really dangerous step when it comes to trying to diagnose a problem. If you have the possibility to record a black box log, then record one and post it here. We can then look at the log and see if there are any clues. Some video that goes together with the log would also be really helpful. What happens after these "good few hard taps"? What are you trying to test? If your motors are getting hot on the bench, how long are you running them for? Without propellers, there's nothing cooling the motors and they will get warm. Too warm is when you can't hold a finger on the motor for more than a couple of seconds. If your motors are getting that hot on the bench then stop overheating them. If you overheat the motors too far, the magnets will start to demagnetise and your kv will start climbing. If you just fly the craft normally, are the motors really hot when you land? If so, there's a problem. If they are merely warm when you land then there isn't. Also, it's unlikely that you would need to change PID settings due to different ESCs. Maybe if you were using ESCs from 2000 and then switched to something modern, but certainly not if we are talking about modern ESCs in both cases. Nearly all my quads fly perfectly on default PIDs using the latest Betaflight. Unless you have oscillation in flight when making a hard turn or during rapid throttle changes, or a problem keeping the same attitude under acceleration, you should not need to change the PIDs. Blindly changing the PID settings without a good reason and without having a specific goal will just make more problems for you. Please understand that I'm not criticising you here; I'm trying to explain that if you have a problem, you must be structured and logical in trying to find the cause and the solution. Changing settings without good reason rarely makes things better and making assumptions will lead you down entirely the wrong path. i was thinkin last night,,,, all night...as i have to pour concrete in 1 hour..lol..that you are exactly right, before i even read your post right now..but its IS something with the FC and something with current....i am almost 100% sure...i have to go to work i 30 minutes, but when i get home ill do a vid. of what im talking about.. oh and i know...im not tryin to fry things here..trust me..it was about a 15-20 second test at idling motors, im pretty sure air mode is off, and i experienced air mode freak out all the time..not just every 3-4 landings, i can land SOFTLY at times and it seems fine..i have cushions on the FC...but thinkin ill put squishier one on. its all good...i want ALL the feed back i can get..this is what i want..yell at me if need be.....so ill listen...i over think stuff and i really dont have ANY one eles to discuss this shit with...im a true SOLO fpver..thanks.. Posts: 139 Threads: 19 Likes Received: 34 in 26 posts Likes Given: 9 Joined: Mar 2017 Reputation: 0 and im still thinkin bout it....ive been over the FC soldering og wires that ive done, seems fine..rechecking everthing..ALL i did was change ESCs and now this...so IDK..more hunting and pecking..lol • |