(01-Jun-2023, 07:17 AM)jasc Wrote: Never seen such a complete answer !?

Yeah, neither have I. I have one on the way, and I'm really looking forward to getting my hands on it, looking at it under my digital microscope, putting it in a build, and seeing what it can do.

I'm a little concerned with its potential limitations with the supposedly buggy am32 esc firmware and its special betaflight fork, but, I'm excited. These things are 1/3 of the price of a comparable stm32 AIO.

edit- they may not have shared their actual test data with me, but, they did share how they went about rating their esc based off of the datasheet, and that's enough for me to know that they are not over rating their esc's. I won't know for sure until I have one in my grubby little hands, but, I expect it to actually be able to handle what they say it can.
I'm honestly less concerned about the esc, and more interested in the mcu, but, it's nice to know that they're not just blowing numbers out of their ass. It gives me significantly more confidence in their company and their product- especially since they are a company I hadn’t heard of prior to this thread.

I get the impression NeutronRC is a smaller/newer company of electronic designers/fpv enthusiasts. They don't seem to even have a website, only FB and a very scant instagram and point to their aliexpress shop for sales (seems Newbee drone also carries a lot of their products in the US). They seem to be keen to try new designs and from their FB postings they share different protos, many which don't actually make it to a final product. Alongside their FC/ESCs there are some more unusual items : 8-in-1 ESC, gyro logger, plus their early adoption of AT32/AM32. It remains to be seen how reliable/well their products perform, but I think the fpv community should welcome and encourage these companies.

Nice you got such a detailed reply, I suspect you weren't just chatting with the tech, but probably the designer. Didn't Speedybee have some issues with their ESCs blowing out a while back, maybe it was the same back EMF issue. And like they pointed out, paper specs and lab testing are only part of the equation, how they actually perform on a drone is more important.
As I build mostly micros, I probably won't get a chance to stress these ESCs.

I did also pickup their ELRS/VTX board (like the Fuyjon) and looks to be an easy setup. Funny how they included a huge ELRS antenna and a tiny whip for the 600mw VTX. It also has a 5v 1A switchable BEC for powering LEDs.
And also their $33 1S ELRS whoop board. Interesting it comes with both a ceramic tower antenna AND a ufl, but I don't see any jumper for switching between the two.

Wow! Great data!

I think you’re right and I was chatting with the designer.

Regarding their 1s 5a aio board and its dual ELRS antenna options- I was trying to get DarwinFPV to do that when they started a thread on this forum asking for feedback when they were designing their 15a ELRS aio. I’m glad to see that NeutronRC actually did it.

I’m excited about NeutronRC. It’s nice to see a new company that is actually innovating, and not just copying everyone else.

(01-Jun-2023, 06:55 AM)Lemonyleprosy Wrote: Alright, I reached out to NeutronRC to get some more info.

They actually had a tech answer me, rather than blowing me off like a number of other companies have done. For that alone, they get points from me, and I am much more likely to buy something from them.

My conversation with NeutronRC is below. The main take aways for the 35A AIO are:
The esc's are rated for 35A constant.
Peak/Burst rating is 45A for 5 seconds.
They did do testing, and their 21xx and smaller motor and prop size are just suggestions to keep you from destroying a mosfet.
They told me what mosfet they use, it is:
Toshiba TPN2R203NC
https://www.mouser.hk/datasheet/2/408/TP...rCMYjL1_qQ

Me:
Someone I know bought the 35A aio to try out. It states that it’s only suitable for 21xx and smaller motors, and only 3.5” to 4” props.
As long as the total amp draw per motor is under 35A, I don’t understand why there are size restrictions?
Do you have any test data on your ESCs that you can share with me?

NeutronRC:
Yes, we have comprehensive data tests for hardware design, MOS performance, parameters, PCB design thermal power consumption, and the reverse voltage generated by the motor when it is working and braking, and the IDm of the MOS.  , safe and reliable configuration recommendations.
How to install the 2207.2306 motor in the 35A version, it may have no problem when it starts to work, normal level flight shooting is no problem, when you do a quick U-turn, or 100% throttle steering, the MOS may burn out, causing the plane to fall
In terms of hardware design, we will take 1/3 of the mos data as the benchmark, stable and reliable working current.

Me:
Thank you. 
Can you please send me those data tests?
Can you also please tell me what the peak/burst current rating is on the 35A aio, and how long it can handle that for?
I have a number of people reach out to me for recommendations on the intofpv.com multirotor forum, and I can’t recommend your electronics without knowing exactly when and how they will fail.

NeutronRC:
https://www.mouser.hk/datasheet/2/408/TP...915945.pdf
ID 100A, according to the industrial application, the value is 35A, which is the reason for using this MOS to mark the parameter 35A. At the same time, its ID is 45A at 25 degrees, so the peak value is 45A. It is customary to follow our standard flight action, and the sudden current is full throttle. Generally, the calculation does not exceed 5 seconds, so his ID MAX burst current definition is 45A for 5 seconds. Idp anti-shock current 200A, in fact, it is very small in FPV use, relatively conservative, it is easy to reach this peak value when the motor brakes, this is the fundamental reason why I limit the 2205 motor, if you use 2207 or 2306 and a larger motor, Fortunately, light braking will not exceed this current, but considering extreme conditions, such as rapid braking to avoid obstacles, at this time, the braking reverse voltage and sink current of the motor will be far greater than 200A, which will cause MOS damage. Based on the above points and the characteristics of the actual motor, a reasonable suggestion is given. The detailed flight data test is more based on a large number of empirical tests that we actually installed on the frame. I think the actual experience is more important than the pure theoretical data. Although the MOS parameters retain a certain amount of redundancy, we still need to retain a reasonable amount of redundancy to achieve reliability and stability while ensuring the reliability of the user framework. So there needs to be a certain limit.


Me:
Thank you, I appreciate the answer and information.
I’ll be ordering one and posting my experience with it.
I really appreciate you actually giving me a proper answer.

——

For those of you that don't regularly reach out to manufacturers to try to get information, this level of detail is rare. The only other manufacturers who have been willing to interact with me on this level are Foxeer and DarwinFPV. I've reached out to just about every other major manufacturer while trying to repair boards, and I typically just get blown off or stuck in a loop of misinterpreted language translations.

Most manufacturers won't even tell you what mosfet they used, much less how they calculated the esc rating.

HI,
guys
I am very happy to see you talking about AT32F435 AIO. After reading your complete reply, I think, I am happy and happy, and the results of my hard work have been affirmed by you.

Let me introduce myself first. I am the brand owner of NEUTRONRC. I am also a product designer. We are a small-scale product design and manufacturing company. In the past few years, I have been concentrating on ODM work. I did not meet you with my own independent brand. In fact, I designed and manufactured Products, in the FPV market, may have been used by one-third of the users, or more, and the conservative number should be about 1 million pieces, or more.
Because I have a small staff and no extra experience to create and maintain web pages, I simply promote my existing brand through facebook and AliExpress.
This is the first time to register for this forum, and it is also the first time to try to communicate and communicate with everyone through the forum.
My English is very bad, and I usually communicate with you through Google Translate, which may involve cultural differences between China and the West, which will bring some inconvenience to communication. But it still doesn't affect my love for FPV.

Our ideas and goals are: we are the game changer and we changed the world
Haha, this may be a fantasy, but I will try it too.

I am very happy to use this forum to directly face everyone's discussions.

(31-May-2023, 11:03 PM)mstc Wrote: Sometimes packages arrive quickly from China. Comes with some thick wires...



In order to connect to BF, it requires downloading/installing an Arterytek driver and the SHOW ALL SERIAL DEVICES option must be enabled in BF Configurator. The NeutronRC page download link is to arterychip.com, the driver is also available on arterytek.com.

And for those with itchy upgrade fingers, NeutronRC explicitly tells you that you don't need to flash different firmware.

The default FC Flash 4.3.2 branch firmware, AM32 ESC flash 1.97 firmware, usually, you don't need flash FC and ESC firmware, just install and set related options according to your settings.

About Betaflight's support for artery MCU:
The current BF 4.4.X version does not support the AT32F435 chip. Our default firmware is based on the 4.3.2 branch. At present, it is seen in the BETAFLIGHT code base that BF4.5 will soon support the AT32F435 chip, and the specific progress is uncertain.

And seems there is a bug on the AM32 web configurator?

2. About The AM32 ESC, There is a known bug in the current website version AM32, which leads to failure after writing or modifying the ESC. We have submitted a PR to fix it. For the time being, you can use our bug-modified Demo ESC Configner settings or upgrade the ESC;


Also note that per NeutronRC, the 35A version of the AIO is only suitable for 21xx or smaller motors.







HI
guys
  You are the first one to receive this product among the packages I sent to the world from AliExpress, very lucky.

(28-May-2023, 03:13 PM)PeladoMat Wrote:  
I did buy a couple of AIO as soon as I found they are supported in Inav 6.1. Seems a perfect match to my Explorer LR 4inch to finally upgrade it to Walksnail.

Yes, we completed support for INAV before the product was nearly complete.

(29-May-2023, 02:59 AM)ph2t Wrote: What I would LOVE to see.

1-2S AM32 esc based AIO AT32 MCU.

My adventures in 1S toothpicks have shown me that bl32 blows bluejay out of the water.  Only the tmotor ($100AUD+) AIO is available.

Good to see betafpv have entered the foray too even though the esc is still 126bit based.  They have a much higher profile than nutronRC and will hopefully have an effect on their competitor's decision making.

My main work now is to complete the production of 1-3S 12A/20A AIO of AM32 branch. All 1-2S AIOs on the market are BLS ESC. Objective problems are unavoidable, I am trying AM32 to use 1-3S WHOOP performance effect, it will take about 6-8 weeks to have new news.

(30-May-2023, 04:59 AM)ph2t Wrote: The overall real power to the motors is just more.  

I've been trying to build a few 1S toothpicks to compare bluejay versus bl32.  Currently rebuilding the bl32 tmotor aio toothpick on a stiffer frame and trying out another one with the 12A AIO betafpv board running RC8 of the PWM version of bluejay.  

Getting motor desyncs and some stalling although this can be because of a multitude of influences like "notchy" motors (mamba 1103 tokas) that don't spin up well through to 48 and 96Khz PWM modes having varying levels of support with the betafpv/jhemcu AIOs.   I'm still testing out different things before I post more in my main toothpick thread.  I will do this soon hopefully.

All this is focused on 1S setup, yes.   It is like the "other" extreme, getting the most out of the limited power that is available.   Digital toothpicks are always going to be in the 45 - 60 gram range and this needs a different powertrain I reakon.

These are the jobs I'm working on. There will be new news to share in about 6-8 weeks, I think I should send here to share as soon as possible.

WEI GUO, welcome to intoFPV! It’s always great to be able to be able to actually talk with the designer/owner/manufacturer.

I’m looking forward to checking out the 35A aio I ordered once it arrives, and I am definitely interested in the 12A or 20A 1-3s am32 aio that you’re working on.

(03-Jun-2023, 05:33 AM)WEI GUO Wrote: These are the jobs I'm working on. There will be new news to share in about 6-8 weeks, I think I should send here to share as soon as possible.

Are you NeutronRC? 
If so, I will make your account vendor verified if that's ok
Welcome to our forum, you are doing a great job with your new products. Keep them coming.

(03-Jun-2023, 02:48 PM)Oscar Wrote: Are you NeutronRC? 
If so, I will make your account vendor verified if that's ok
Welcome to our forum, you are doing a great job with your new products. Keep them coming.

Yes, I am NeutronRC. At the same time, all the products of this brand are designed by me personally, and the facebook homepage and the facebook Guo Wei with the same name are mine alone.

(03-Jun-2023, 05:33 AM)WEI GUO Wrote: These are the jobs I'm working on. There will be new news to share in about 6-8 weeks, I think I should send here to share as soon as possible.

This is very exciting!  I have sent you a PM.



Cheers,

ph2t.

(03-Jun-2023, 03:17 PM)ph2t Wrote: This is very exciting!  I have sent you a PM.



Cheers,

ph2t.

This is the first time I use this minimalist English group, which means that many places have not understood his meaning, including, you told me about a PM you gave me, depending on where I haven’t found it yet

(03-Jun-2023, 03:32 PM)WEI GUO Wrote: This is the first time I use this minimalist English group, which means that many places have not understood his meaning, including, you told me about a PM you gave me, depending on where I haven’t found it yet

In the upper right hand of this forum, you should be able to click on Private Messages. This is a PM.