Two Freestyle Quads, both 5", both new 2022 issues, both around the same weight.

This is part of their DUMP details:-

QUAD ONE

rateprofile 0
 
# rateprofile 0
set rates_type = ACTUAL
set roll_rc_rate = 19
set pitch_rc_rate = 19
set yaw_rc_rate = 19
set roll_expo = 60
set pitch_expo = 60
set yaw_expo = 60
set roll_srate = 90
set pitch_srate = 90
set yaw_srate = 90
set tpa_rate = 60
set tpa_breakpoint = 1280
 
 
QUAD TWO
 
rateprofile 0
 
# rateprofile 0
set rateprofile_name = -
set thr_mid = 50
set thr_expo = 0
set rates_type = BETAFLIGHT
set roll_rc_rate = 115
set pitch_rc_rate = 115
set yaw_rc_rate = 100
set roll_expo = 0
set pitch_expo = 0
set yaw_expo = 0
set roll_srate = 70
set pitch_srate = 70
set yaw_srate = 70
set tpa_rate = 65
set tpa_breakpoint = 1350
set tpa_mode = D
set throttle_limit_type = OFF
set throttle_limit_percent = 100
set roll_rate_limit = 1998
set pitch_rate_limit = 1998
set yaw_rate_limit = 1998
 


SO, despite their similarity in physical size, equipment, power, and intended purpose, there's quite a gulf between the way they have been set up by the manufacturer, with wildly differing numbers, for example, look at ROLL:-

19, 60, 90 type ACTUAL against 115, 0, 70 type BETAFLIGHT.

So, one is using 60 expo on a very low rate of 19, the other a very high rate on 115 and no expo.

They actually perform fairly similarly despite these differences, which does not help my understanding of what and why!

Discuss?

Whoever set the rate profiles on those quads at the factory would have done so for their own personal preference. That is all. So feel free to change them to whatever your rate setting preferences are. If you set both quads to use your same preferred rate values then I bet they would still both have the same flying feel to them.

PIDs on the other hand are a different story and may need to be different between quads depending on the characteristics of the quad and the hardware used on it, although on a 5" quad more often than not the default Betaflight PIDs tend to work just fine.

Different test pilots? Different people tune quads differently to match their flying style.

Thanks for replies.

The point I was trying to make was not about personal preferences, but about the yawning gulf in number terms of the two set ups, and yet they feel nearly the same when flown back to back.

Here a number of 19, there a number of 115. On the face of it that's HUGE, but its not in results.

That leads to the feeling that all the "tuning" and playing with numbers actually seems to do very little at all!!

If I set "my" numbers on both, (not that I'd have a clue IN NUMBER TERMS what I prefer!!), and they STILL fly similarly to these disparate sets, what is the point in having such adjustment variance available, as its making no difference?

And here's the base PIDS, not necc in the same order!

set p_pitch = 68
set i_pitch = 99
set d_pitch = 55
set f_pitch = 114
set p_roll = 65
set i_roll = 94
set d_roll = 52
set f_roll = 108
set p_yaw = 50
set i_yaw = 99
set d_yaw = 0
set f_yaw = 100


set p_pitch = 48
set i_pitch = 90
set d_pitch = 38
set f_pitch = 95
set p_roll = 44
set i_roll = 85
set d_roll = 35
set f_roll = 90
set p_yaw = 50
set i_yaw = 90
set d_yaw = 0
set f_yaw = 90

(09-May-2022, 03:23 PM)BadRaven Wrote: Thanks for replies.

The point I was trying to make was not about personal preferences, but about the yawning gulf in number terms of the two set ups, and yet they feel nearly the same when flown back to back.

Here a number of 19, there a number of 115.  On the face of it that's HUGE, but its not in results.

That leads to the feeling that all the "tuning" and playing with numbers actually seems to do very little at all!!

If I set "my" numbers on both, (not that I'd have a clue IN NUMBER TERMS what I prefer!!), and they STILL fly similarly to these disparate sets, what is the point in having such adjustment variance available, as its making no difference?

You can't compared those CLI number directly like that  as one quad is using Actual rate and  the other quad is using the traditional betaflight rate. 


19 number on the CLI line  is 190 centre stick rate and 90 is Max rate of 900 degree/s in BF configurator Actual rate. 900 deg/s is actually fairly aggressive.

The quad with betaflight  rate (115  on CLi line) has a 1.15 RC rate in BF configurator , not that aggressive in my opinion (  to me  anyway as i used to fly 1.80- 2.1)  and S Rate of 730-740 degree seconds with no expo in this case.

Despite your intial perception of the big difference in the number between the quad , the Betaflight rate quad has  slower  roll/pitch max velocity at the end of stick movements. Anyway, the rate curves are not as drastically different as you might have perceived from  the number difference on the Cli numbers you had quoted.

Hence depending on how you fly  and pid, props/motors, you may not experience a big difference between them at the moment.



Here's an article from Oscar regarding rare.

https://oscarliang.com/rc-roll-pitch-yaw...eanflight/

Thanks.

It seems very counter productive to use (without clear explanation AFAICS) a different order of magnitude (90 for 900, and 115 being 1,15 for example), just designed to confuse.

Not going into too many details, Actual rates are what makes the most sense and should be what everyone should use.